Omnimaga

Omnimaga => Our Projects => Escheron: Twilight over Ragnoth => Topic started by: Geekboy1011 on October 23, 2015, 10:09:49 pm

Title: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on October 23, 2015, 10:09:49 pm
Welcome to the alpha testing thread for Escheron: Twilight over Ragnoth.


This is a closed alpha. What does that mean for you all? It means you need to be granted access to participate. Sadly there are also a limited number of slots due to a request by Zera to keep story exposure to a minimum. No reason to spoil the story to the whole community before the game is out

To be granted access to participate in this beta you must send me a private message detailing why you are good candidate for the alpha, and how much time you are willing to dedicate to the project. What we are asking for is below in the read me included in this post.

Quote

/---------Escheron: Twilight Over Ragnoth ~ Alpha--------------
|
|                  Rodger "Iambian" Weisman
|                 Tim 'Geekboy1011' Keller
|                           Zera
|
/----------- All these dots must fit on one line. -------------
|
|..............................................................
|
/---------------------------Preface----------------------------
|
|  This is the initial, and first official, semi public release
|     Of E:ToR. Welcome to the world of Escheron!
|
/---------------------------Scope------------------------------
|
|  In this alpha test we are looking for you to run around and
|     try to break all of the things. No seriously I mean it
|     We want to know all of the bugs you can find. So we can
|     fix them and make this a better game for everyone.
|
|
|  On top of all of that we want your opinion, yes you have
|     one. We want you to let us know what you think of the
|     maps, user interface, Dialog display issues and well
|     anything.
|
/----------------Known Issues And Incomplete areas-------------
|
|   I: Why is there no fancy title screen, Those are the best.
|   S: Because that is a project killer! Would not just want
|          "Another Fancy Title Screen Demo v9001" again do
|          we?
|
|   I: Fey Wood is not a puzzle yet.
|   S: We know it will be implemented in beta
|
|   I: While using NoClip X.....
|   S: Yeah anything abnormal in noclip mode will be ignored
|          Or marked as wontfix. Seriously its for debug use
|
|   I: Why is it not smooth scrolling?
|   S: Pepperidge Farms rememebers we tried that once.....
|
|   I: Using DevBlock while on the (air)ship makes me fly/sail
|          indoors.
|   S: Yeah we know. Its fun right? Call it a feature.
|          (Its a debug item people....)
|
|   I: I can't take items/delete spells on the Guest NPC's
|   S: We know, it's coded that way to save you from deleting
|          important items as we do not track their inventory
|
/------------------------Controls------------------------------
|
|  2nd = Comfirm
|  Mode = Back
|  D-Pad = move
|
/----------------------Debug Controls--------------------------
|
|  Y= Debug info, Toggle Noclip mode
|  Del = Generate and spawn in a random Underdeep map

/-----------------------Debug Items----------------------------
|
|  Devblock = Use it to return to the debug map from anywhere
|
/---------------------Additional Notes-------------------------
|
|  The battle engine is not completed. Instead you get a popup
|     saying what you would have encountered. You can figure
|     out what you encountered in Src/Data/EnemyFormations.z80

|  We want to know what you think of the flow of maps. Do they
|     feel appropriatly sized and spaced, Not confusing etc.
|
|  The underdeep is 8 floors deep. Using Del will reset you to
|     floor 1
|

/--------------------Thank you for testing!--------------------
|
|Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee Coffee
|      Rrrrrraaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!~~~~~~
|

Those of you accepted into the alpha will be granted access to "supported" Alpha dev builds. After the alpha period is over we will gladly send you a new build to continue testing as we add new feature and what not. All you need to do is ask. Hopefully that is some good incentive for you all to apply!

Seriously everyone if you have the time apply. We are not looking for any specific skill set in this. We are just looking for some people with the time and inclination to scour the game for bad/messed up content, because quite frankly we have been staring at this for way to long and have a long time to go. So some fresh eyes are really welcome!
 

I will add a list of accepted alpha testers upon me making that decision. Currently I have received 3 request for participation.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on November 01, 2015, 07:06:11 pm
The alpha testers have been decided!

They are
@calcdude84se (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/calcdude84se/)
@Chirlian (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/Chirlian/)
@merthsoft (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/merthsoft/)
@pimathbrainiac (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/pimathbrainiac/)
@Escheron (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/Escheron/)
They have been sent the alpha, Thank you all for your applications. Now lets get bug hunting! Hopefully this thread will get active now :P
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Escheron on November 01, 2015, 07:17:21 pm
BUGS:

* Equipping armor / armlets does not apply relevant Agility adjustments.

* Equipping armor / armlets does not apply relevant Intellect adjustments.

* Magic shops claim that characters have no room left, even though they do.

* Spells cost 0 MP to cast.

* Poison status has no effect.

* Stat-up items have no effect if a character is dead. Shouldn't they be usable either way?

* Essentially every (weapon) shop inventory has incorrect listings. For example: Ragnoth's weapon shop (in the village) offers Collosus claws, Ebony armor and Spartan clothes. Its inventory should be Staff, Clothes and Fairy armlet. The erroneous listings actually have the same buy values as the items that are supposed to be there.

* The flame in the Tristran lighthouse cannot be extinguished. (At least, not by Edmund?)

* Why isn't the aforementioned flame animated?

* The guy in Ragnoth's root cellar has a line that should end with a quote: [have to use swords."]

* Floor 6 of the Underdeep dropped me into a room filled with random tiles. (See screenshot)
(http://s27.postimg.org/rl9fydzcj/wabbitemu.png)

* On the airship / party swap, Maya should be facing up, not right.


NITPICKS:

* The item properties string "Has no spell charges." should perhaps be without a period to appear more consistent with other menu strings.

* The Emergency Exit tile in the Underdeep doesn't enclose the period inside the quotation marks. This is inconsistent with my style of grammar.

* The encounter rate in the Underdeep is still fairly high. Considering the length of each floor, the encounter rate should probably be closer to half of what it is now.

* When navigating to the equipment or magic screens, the cursor retains its position depending on which character you selected. In the case of the equipment screen, this results in the first item highlighted being the shield slot or armor slot. Shouldn't the cursor position be reset each time you enter a new menu or sub-menu?

* For ease of navigation, should pressing a directional button while on the status screen switch to another party member's status?
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Iambian on November 06, 2015, 09:58:23 pm
@calcdude84se
@Chirlian
@merthsoft
@pimathbrainiac

Bug fixes pushed in revision 427 (c3730ade74ee)

 Magic shop display bugs
 Mana costs
 Airship: Maya should face up
 Lighthouse event fixed. Yes/No event repaired.
 Underdeep warp location moved
 Walking around while poisoned should hurt.
 Ragnoth root cellar, typo (missing quote)
 Item description consistency fix
 Item shop description scrollability
 AGI and INT should update in status screen wrt equipment

Note: Underdeep and shop bugs were not reproduceable due to Escheron using a non-clean build.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on November 06, 2015, 10:05:48 pm
Alpha branch updated. Zip was updated to reflect the new alpha.

@calcdude84se (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/calcdude84se/)
@Chirlian (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/Chirlian/)
@merthsoft (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/merthsoft/)
@pimathbrainiac (https://www.omnimaga.org/profile/pimathbrainiac/)
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: pimathbrainiac on November 07, 2015, 12:04:38 pm
I shall be taking a look today! Thanks!
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: calcdude84se on November 07, 2015, 10:13:49 pm
This is all with respect to revision 428. If any of this warrants reporting on Bitbucket, let me know.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on November 07, 2015, 10:40:38 pm
Most of this I think could be on the bitbucket. Would allow us to track it a little nicer :P if you have the time. That aside Can you clarify on point 4 please, Zera would like to know which towns so it can be updated.

As for most of the other things Iambian will look into some of them and see what can be done. Ill explain in more detail in a bit. If he does not get to it first.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Escheron on November 07, 2015, 10:50:49 pm
  • Exiting a map back to the overworld sometimes puts you on the space corresponding to the map, and other times one square in some direction which varies per map. It'd be nice if you consistently came out the same way.

Do you want the player to appear directly on top of the warp? Since you can enter some areas from multiple directions, I can't place the character one tile away from whatever direction they entered from. IMO, I just didn't think placing the player directly on top of the warp felt right.

Quote
  • The speech boxes sometimes have little arrows in the bottom corner to indicate continuation. However, it's not a reliable indicator of that, since a good amount of multi-screen dialog doesn't always use them.

This is intentional. The arrow indicates a thought / sentence that exceeds the length of the window. When a thought / sentence is completed, any subsequent dialogs spawn new windows instead of being directed by arrows.

I hope that explanation made sense.

Quote
  • Selecting a spell to display its description shifts the upper border down by 1 pixel, which I find distracting

Ditto. I also have my gripes with the small amount of black space in shopkeeper's inventories. I think Iambian says the menu layouts involve a bit of compromise.

Quote
  • If you can't equip something, an error message explaining why would be helpful

I think this has been in planning.[/list]

----

Do you have any thoughts on the game's aesthetics? e.g. World size, dungeon layouts, etc. Map designs are subject to change as well.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Iambian on November 07, 2015, 11:02:45 pm
This is all with respect to revision 428. If any of this warrants reporting on Bitbucket, let me know.
  • The Window, Zoom, Trace, and Graph buttons act like the direction arrows. Presumably it's because of how you're scanning the keys.
  • When you can't obtain an item from a chest because your pack is full, the item stays in the chest but the chest appears open. If you come back to the map later, the chest is closed.
  • It'd be nice if scrolling wrapped top to bottom, since it would make it quicker to access later items / spells.
  • Exiting a map back to the overworld sometimes puts you on the space corresponding to the map, and other times one square in some direction which varies per map. It'd be nice if you consistently came out the same way.
  • Exiting the boat onto the airship leaves you standing on top of the airship, while exiting a submap that moves you onto the airship makes you start riding it. This feels inconsistent.
  • The speech boxes sometimes have little arrows in the bottom corner to indicate continuation. However, it's not a reliable indicator of that, since a good amount of multi-screen dialog doesn't always use them.
  • Selecting a spell to display its description shifts the upper border down by 1 pixel, which I find distracting
  • Using "equip" to change out equipment works differently from selecting an item from "items". It doesn't describe the item you're about to equip.
  • It would be nice to be able to view the descriptions of equipped items without having to unequip them.
  • If you can't equip something, an error message explaining why would be helpful
Good call. Many of these will be noted on the TODO list to be worked on, which will happen after I get a more automated selective sprite masking system in place.

1. That is indeed the manner in which the keys are scanned. Unless it becomes a major issue, I don't see myself splitting the keygroups.
2. Treasure chest behavior is by design, though everyone else on the dev team is against me on this so... yeah. I'll fix it. On TODO list.
3. Scrolling. Sure, will check on it. On TODO list.
4. I'm a bit late on responding to that. Oops.
5. Haven't noticed that behavior before. Will look into it. On TODO list.
6. This is by design. It was also explained in a post while I wasn't looking. Yay Omni and its warning about other postings.
7. Spell descriptor window. Noted. On TODO list.
8,9,10. Rolled into the TODO list item: "General equip system overhaul to be more helpful."

-------------------------------
Update to revision 438 (9cd9e394d813) default branch. Its commit message is terribly nondescript. Here's some meat.

NOT FIXED:
 General equip system overhaul to be more helpful.
 Magic formulae need to use derived INT, not base.

FIXED:
 sprite automasking
 Inns now checks for empty slots instead of corrupting memory.
 Treasure chests should not be open if you can't get item from it
 Item/magic scrolling should wrap top to bottom
 Spell descriptor is incongruent with spell list by 1 pixel. Fix it.
 Exit locations to overworld and badlands are on top of submap entrance

WONTFIX:
 Exit location to on top of airship autoboards airship. This behavior is critical for Asnoth and Arcanian Summit exit.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on November 09, 2015, 04:40:00 pm
Will pull to alpha and distribute before evening end.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Escheron on November 12, 2015, 08:07:05 pm
The alpha phase was supposed to end about a week ago, and unfortunately the only volunteer generous enough to submit any findings was calcdude84se, whom we appreciate very much.

As for our other volunteers - @Chirlian, @merthsoft and @pimathbrainiac - all of them seem to be MIA. As a result, Geekboy1011 keeps pushing the deadline further. Bear in mind, we're losing valuable development time waiting for these reports to come in. If you guys have lost interest in the project or simply do not have enough free time to continue, I would appreciate your forwardness.

Lastly, a gentle reminder: Volunteers not actively participating in the alpha will not be included anywhere in the game's credits.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: pimathbrainiac on November 13, 2015, 09:05:33 am
Sorry about that. I haven't had time to do anything with school and all. I'll give some feedback over the weekend. Promise.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: 123outerme on November 13, 2015, 02:01:28 pm
Are you guys going to need testers for the CSE version? If so, I'll send me application. (And yes, I know I've asked like 20 million times, sorry :P)
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Escheron on November 13, 2015, 04:26:01 pm
I'll give some feedback over the weekend. Promise.

That would be much appreciated. Any feedback you can submit will be helpful.

Are you guys going to need testers for the CSE version?

Insofar, the CSE port is just the base game with a compatibility layer tacked on. Escheron won't be properly ported to the CSE will full color support because that would necessitate a complete rewrite.

Whether or not @Geekboy1011 will want to submit a test release is entirely up to him.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: 123outerme on November 13, 2015, 04:54:29 pm
Are you guys going to need testers for the CSE version?

Insofar, the CSE port is just the base game with a compatibility layer tacked on. Escheron won't be properly ported to the CSE will full color support because that would necessitate a complete rewrite.

Whether or not @Geekboy1011 will want to submit a test release is entirely up to him.
That's understandable. Thanks for the quick response, and I look forward to the game's release :)
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: pimathbrainiac on November 17, 2015, 09:00:42 am
I have a few cents to put in!
(https://img.ourl.ca/alphaversion.png)
(don't worry; I turned noclip off after taking this :P)

1) There are some overworld chests that won't open here:
(http://img.ourl.ca/deezchests.png)

2) The encounter rate is a little high in general. I'm getting encounters about every 5 to 15 steps, with the distribution closer to 5 than 15.

3) The dreadnaught confuses me in the balance of scripted and random encounters. The frequency of scripted encounters, in my opinion, would dictate there be fewer, if any, random encounters. I once went from a scripted encounter, took a single step, and ran in to a random one.

4) The item limit. I use a few potions, and can only buy up to a certain number back so I can have a total number of items combined. I know it's nitpickey, but it feels arbitrary. I don't know how your item data is stored, though, so it might be necessary.

5) I get weird encounter text when I step on this skull. Debug thing, maybe?
(https://img.ourl.ca/disskull.png)

That's all I had time to do this weekend (due to a few unforseen events). I'll get more to you soon.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: calcdude84se on November 17, 2015, 04:55:04 pm
And I'm finally getting back to y'all again. Sorry about the delay; the end of the semester's been busy.
I've not tested a newer revision than 428 yet, so hopefully none of this is out of date, but I will start getting around to it after I post this.

Do you want the player to appear directly on top of the warp? Since you can enter some areas from multiple directions, I can't place the character one tile away from whatever direction they entered from. IMO, I just didn't think placing the player directly on top of the warp felt right.
I'm mainly interested in it being consistent, e.g. always in the same direction. I can see placing the player on top of the warp feeling weird.
On that note, it would be nice if exiting the airship didn't leave you on top of it, but doing so in a consistent direction is only feasible if the maps are set up right because you can land lots of places; off the top of my head I don't know if they are.

Quote
This is intentional. The arrow indicates a thought / sentence that exceeds the length of the window. When a thought / sentence is completed, any subsequent dialogs spawn new windows instead of being directed by arrows.

I hope that explanation made sense.
That makes sense. In that case, I might appreciate an indication when the entire dialog is done.
More importantly, I've been a bit annoyed when skimming through the dialogs and pressing [2ND] one too many times means reading through the entire thing again.

Quote
Do you have any thoughts on the game's aesthetics? e.g. World size, dungeon layouts, etc. Map designs are subject to change as well.
I have yet to have a strong opinion on this.
My initial opinion was that it all seemed good.  None of the levels are too small, I feel, and the largest ones are more difficult to get one's bearings in but it's not unmanageable. I like the variability.
I'll try to focus more on it in the future.

2. Treasure chest behavior is by design, though everyone else on the dev team is against me on this so... yeah. I'll fix it. On TODO list.
Alternatively, it would be cool if it opened and then closed again.

Quote
WONTFIX:
 Exit location to on top of airship autoboards airship. This behavior is critical for Asnoth and Arcanian Summit exit.
I'm actually fine with autoboarding, but it would be nice if exiting the ship onto the airship did this as well.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: 123outerme on November 17, 2015, 05:20:58 pm
Just a few things that I've noticed in the most recent revision, revision 220+ (as noted in the Y= information):
*It seems that running the app, then quitting with ON (which is as far as I can tell the only way to exit the app) leaves about 6000 bytes taken away from RAM, as seen here:
(http://i.imgur.com/Gl9PbLc.gif)
This means that if you run the game once, to run it again you must clear RAM. There are no items in the "Memory Management: 1. All" menu.

*Just a really small nitpicky thing, but you forgot a space in between "bytes" and "are". Also, there seem to be 3 spaces between "to" and "run". So it seems to be formatted to display correctly for monochrome screens. Like I said, a really small nitpicky thing that you probably already know about.
(http://i.imgur.com/iLx5SPc.png)

Aside from all those things, it looks pretty solidly built! I have yet to go through and do more grindy testing, but that's what I noticed when I was first trying it out.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Geekboy1011 on November 17, 2015, 05:24:02 pm
For most of those...uhh idk i have to look at the first one. The second one is because its the same info as used on the b/w one and not formatted. It is literately the same code. So the formatting is off.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: Escheron on November 17, 2015, 11:24:47 pm
1) There are some overworld chests that won't open here:
(http://img.ourl.ca/deezchests.png)

Those are generic chests found in the debug room, which is the map you initially spawn in. They're not supposed to be filled, or they'll be filled at a later time when Iambian or Geekboy1011 decides to put something in them. For the time being, they're just placeholders.

Quote
2) The encounter rate is a little high in general. I'm getting encounters about every 5 to 15 steps, with the distribution closer to 5 than 15.

We're working on balancing that. I feel the encounter rate in the Underdeep is especially too high.

Quote
3) The dreadnaught confuses me in the balance of scripted and random encounters. The frequency of scripted encounters, in my opinion, would dictate there be fewer, if any, random encounters. I once went from a scripted encounter, took a single step, and ran in to a random one.

The scripted encounters shouldn't seem confusing, since you actually have to walk up to the guards and speak to them to initiate a battle.

Regardless, the Dreadnought is a late-game dungeon, so it's naturally more of a pain in the ass to navigate.

Quote
4) The item limit. I use a few potions, and can only buy up to a certain number back so I can have a total number of items combined. I know it's nitpickey, but it feels arbitrary. I don't know how your item data is stored, though, so it might be necessary.

Intentional design choice, even though it is rather arbitrary. We're going for the look and feel of retro console RPGs, including some of the limitations they imposed on players.

To be fair though, 32 items max is pretty flexible, given the amount of content in the game.

Quote
5) I get weird encounter text when I step on this skull. Debug thing, maybe?
(https://img.ourl.ca/disskull.png)

Intentional. It's a forced encounter tile, similar to those you'd find in the original Final Fantasy. There are a few other instances of this found in the game.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: pimathbrainiac on November 18, 2015, 05:59:51 am

Quote
3) The dreadnaught confuses me in the balance of scripted and random encounters. The frequency of scripted encounters, in my opinion, would dictate there be fewer, if any, random encounters. I once went from a scripted encounter, took a single step, and ran in to a random one.

The scripted encounters shouldn't seem confusing, since you actually have to walk up to the guards and speak to them to initiate a battle.

Regardless, the Dreadnought is a late-game dungeon, so it's naturally more of a pain in the ass to navigate.

It's not the scripted encounters that seem confusing, just the rate of random encounters in relation to the number of scripted encounters. Regardless, if that's a design choice, it is your all's choice.
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 03, 2015, 08:54:04 pm
A little map design thing: I use the airship to get to the cave entrance and end up in the dwarves area after going through the cave. I then would have to go through the rather expansive cave to get back to the airship. I suggest a warp to the cave entrance from the dwarves town or the shipyard, unless you wish for some extra grinding :P

EDIT: also most of the cave-like dungeons seem a bit cramped with the paths to walk. I kept running into things when I was going through them. Iambian says this was something about getting lost, so might I suggest some sort of map that gets filled out as you discovers stuff similar to the Zelda games?
Title: Re: E:ToR ~ Alpha Test thread
Post by: 123outerme on February 24, 2016, 08:50:17 pm
Has there been a new build released for testing yet? I don't think so based on the distribution website, but I can't really tell.