Post by: leofox on August 26, 2006, 12:43:00 pm
I know i haven't been posting on the forums, but most of you will know me, either from the IRC channel #omnimaga or from other forums like MaxCoderz or UnitedTI.
If you have been visiting the latter lately, you might have seen this topic: http://www.unitedti.org/index.php?showtopic=5597. I just want to tell my side of the story.
On the late afternoon of friday the 25th, it began with Toksyuryel, a member of the #Unitedti IRC channel, saying to Dantes (the_unknown_one) in not so many words that he didn't have the right to stick Plushie in his nickname, because it was something special for Telroth that he doesn't understand. This had me kinda confused, i thought that he was a furry. I that day was especially mad at the furries, because in my opinion they are the reason that 4chan's /b/ died, one of my favourite forums for driving away boredom.
So anyway, Dantes(the_unknown_one) said that he liked plushie things too, like stuffed animals. I replied with something like "yeah me too, but i don't put my d*** in them". My first offense.
Toksyuryel kicked me for that one. I was pretty pissed at him for that, he said some stuff at me, started being stuck up like he was the only one who knew what telroth wanted and kicking me every line, like he was better than me. That made me even more angry and i said a 4chan phrase "yiff in hell furfags". Yiff is a slang term for furry sex, the rest you can make up yourself. Not smart to say in an otherkin based network amirite...
Now remember, i'm an op at #UnitedTI too, i was it all the time during that stuff (just sometimes they took it away but hopping would get it back). I could've used the kickban all the time, but i didn't want to. But man was i tempted.
After that i had some dinner, and i watched snakes on a plane on my computer. I had a couple of beers and some Martini (good stuff ^_^) so i wasn't completely at my senses. I was tired too because it was late. When i came back it was normal for a while, i was a bit rude against SQLdemon a few times, but that was just because i didn't know that he was AlienCC. I remember that when i whois'd him and found out that he was AlienCC, i was a bit shocked, because i said some rude things.
But after a while the issue came back, Toksyuryel was rude again and everyone seemed to be at his side. I tried to be funny a few times but that only made it worse. AlienCC was preaching at me (i hate it when ppl do that, was does he have to say about my life?) but after a while it was alright. At least that's what i thought.
We had a pretty reasonable discussion on otherkin, i got some explanations on the Plushie thing. But after a while things got out of hand again when i posted "animal sex is illegal in most countries" as a reply. AlienCC kicked me again, i was kinda confused because i didn't think that was bad of me to post. Later i heard that he doesn't want us to post bad words in the chan because when his boss walks past and sees bad words on his screen he'd be in trouble or w/e. For me that sounds very hypocritic. If you don't want to be in trouble for being on IRC during work, don't be on IRC during work. Common sense, do you use it?! Instead, i got in trouble again and i became angry again.
I did some pretty bad stuff i suppose, posted yiff in hell again and stuff. Later i heard that AlienCC had me banned 21 days not only from the channel, something i can understand though 3 weeks is a bit long, but from the UTI forums too. I did nothing bad there did I?! I am one of the most active community members still, i was one of the few to get a paid subscription, i submitted popular files and i participate in contests. Apparently this is how Jon treats his members.
Today i found out that he made a topic about me, which i couldn't watch because i was banned. He and other people were just talking bad around my back about me, and not allowing me to talk back or even see it. Can you imagine how that feels? I spent a few minutes trying to get a good proxy, and i read the topic. There i saw that AlienCC made all the logs public, gave his side of the story without letting me speak etc. Some people were behind me, i was very happy to see Xlibman and some other members sticking it up for me. But other members got angry at me too, even those that weren't even there.
So basically, AlienCC wrecked my reputation in the community without even letting me speak for myself, gave me an unreasonable ban, for something i did only one evening. Everyone has a bad day sometimes don't they?
This is why i won't come back to United-TI. I'll be posting here or at MaxCoderz sometimes for help at my latest secret project, but you can understand why i can't go back to UTI anymore.
This is my side of the story, i hope it makes you understand the situation more. I regret what i did a lot, but i don't think it's comparable to my punishment.
--Leofox
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 26, 2006, 02:01:00 pm
I've actually had a discussion with leofox about this earlier, he told me what happened and such. However I've taken time to read the logs as well to get both version of the facts. I will do my point, and only once, I dont want to tell leofox and the mod what to do, it is only my point of view. I do not want this to end up in an argument, but I often have different opinion from other people and I fear it might, but please see this only as my point of view and please read my entire post carefully to avoid misunderstood.
First leofox did bad in the IRC channel, especially insulting Tok. He got told to stop, and continued. So the 21 day IRC ban was deserved. However I do not recall any TOS infrigment on the forums. Imho I feel the forum ban is unjustified and while a ban may have been deserved it should not be as long as on the IRC channel. 1 day at the least, and 7 at the top, if not No ban at all on the forums. If the incident would have happened on the forums, and not on IRC, then it would be vice versa. I feel it is unfair as Drak has been permbanned from the forums and he can still go in the IRC channel, while leofox cannot go on both. That said, will NOT hold ANY grudge against leofox for what he did
first of all I've never seen leofox doing something like this before, ever. I fear he may be going through some sort depression, I dunno if he is, but thats a possibility, because I remember him feeling down not so long ago right before he went in vacation in france and I am kinda worried about him right now.
second of all Toks started it with the plushie thing. Was starting that argument about plushie nickname and bandwagooning necessary at all? maybe this would have avoided this from happening? Leofox told me he went mad at that point, and while I think what he did was uncalled for i dont think he would have done this if toks didnt started harrasing leofox and Dantes about that bandwagooning thing. Is there any IRC rules that state that it is prohibited to use the _Plushie suffix in your nickname without permission? No, so I dont see why this argument that triggered all those event and this ban was necessary at all.
Third of all: this topic was totally unnecessary at all. Is this necessary to ternish leofox reputation toward EVERY single visitor who are gonna read this topic? This stuff should have been kept on IRC, and if leofox had any staff/forum privileges then just post a news saying he has been demoted for TOS violation. This topic doesnt deserves to exist at all. What if leofox want to apologise for what he did? What if he want his reputation to be good again, by not doing this again? Everyone has the right for a second chance, and to apologise. He's gonna have this right after the ban expires, but this topic is NOT gonna help^ at all. Everyone do mistakes anyway and they learn from them. Leofox will (I hope) learn (or alerady learned) a lesson from this, and no one should be holding any grudge against him, and everyone who were not nice to him should apologise afterward. I do not know if he will come back here, and it is his choice to come back or not, but if he come back, there should not be any hatering toward him. Personally i was not involved in this event, and as leofox has been nice with me in overall I will not hold any grudge against him at all, and as I am a bit agaisnt the actions taken against him, I will continue to support him til the end. As he got banned and cannot see this topic I will try to help him understand what he did bad while I think both parties are wrong, and I know he will understand. I do not like seeing fights like this in the community as this is making me very upset
anyway I just wanted to make a point, and I hope you realise that both parties are not fully right, but you are entitled to your own opinion, and I hope leofox realised I still respect him, providing he won't do this again
Note: this is the same post than what I posted on UTI in the topic, I'm sorry to see things went this way, I hope you enjoy your stay here and at MaxCoderz. Btw sry for becoming upset all the time for small reasons on IRC :(
Post by: elfprince13 on August 26, 2006, 03:20:00 pm
unfortunately you did violate the forum TOS (on IRC...), but still, 21 days is too long a ban for 1 incident after that many years of you being an active member. UTI (most of us anyway) will miss you if you choose to stay away.
Post by: Darth Android on August 26, 2006, 03:32:00 pm
QuoteBegin-leofox+-->
| QUOTE (leofox) |
| it began with Toksyuryel, a member of the #Unitedti IRC channel, saying to Dantes (the_unknown_one) in not so many words that he didn't have the right to stick Plushie in his nickname, because it was something special for Telroth that he doesn't understand. |
First, while Toksyuryel may have spoke on my behalf, he had no right to, whereas people do have a right to put plushie on their nicknames. My whole point i was trying to make about plushies it that it does vary from person to person on what it means to them, and you can't just assume that because they have |Plushie on their name that it means any specific things.
QuoteBegin-leofox+
| QUOTE (leofox) |
| I replied with something like "yeah me too, but i don't put my d*** in them". My first offense. |
The problem was the general assumption that all furries or everyone with |Plushie did this (your comment implied this assumption). There are some people who do this, but being a furry or a plushie or having |Plushie in your nickname has nothing to do with it. If anyone's ever had a teddy bear, then they've like plushies too before. That's usually what "I like plushies" means.
QuoteBegin-leofox+
| QUOTE (leofox) |
| That made me even more angry and i said a 4chan phrase "yiff in hell furfags". Yiff is a slang term for furry sex, the rest you can make up yourself. Not smart to say in an otherkin based network amirite... |
FYI it yiffing mean that or cybering in general. And it's not that there's a lot of otherkin on the server that are specifically taking offence to this. Yiffing or not, you did tell everyone to go to hell, which I can see others getting angry at.
QuoteBegin-leofox+
| QUOTE (leofox) |
| But after a while things got out of hand again when i posted "animal sex is illegal in most countries" as a reply. AlienCC kicked me again, i was kinda confused because i didn't think that was bad of me to post. Later i heard that he doesn't want us to post bad words in the chan because when his boss walks past and sees bad words on his screen he'd be in trouble or w/e. For me that sounds very hypocritic. |
I wasn't using AlienCC as a specific example, but the work scenario as an example in general.
To the above three quotes: The biggest offence was the language. I am usually pretty lax on language on the server, but the problem is UTI is a specific draw to children a young as 12 (that's 7th grade, when my school starts offering algebra for which we have to get a graphic calc). There is no way for us to monitor the people entering to make sure their parents allow them to visit the site or what their ages are. This means we have to keep the channel clean at all times. The beauty of IRC is there are 40^32 different channels, and As long as you are the owner of a channel and aren't breaking the server rules, you can do whatever you want. My goal was not to prevent the discussion from happening, but to prevent it from happening in #unitedti.
QuoteBegin-xlibman+
| QUOTE (xlibman) |
| second of all Toks started it with the plushie thing. Was starting that argument about plushie nickname and bandwagooning necessary at all? maybe this would have avoided this from happening? |
Who started it doesn't matter, and never does in any situation. People should have enough maturity to know when to end it.
QuoteBegin-xlibman+
| QUOTE (xlibman) |
| i dont think he would have done this if toks didnt started harrasing leofox and Dantes about that bandwagooning thing. Is there any IRC rules that state that it is prohibited to use the _Plushie suffix in your nickname without permission? |
Harassing is against the rules, and if Toks was harassing them then they should have alerted me or Iambian asap.
QuoteBegin-xlibman+
| QUOTE (xlibman) |
| I am a bit agaisnt the actions taken against him |
A bit? I'd say you are strongly against, as am I.
QuoteBegin-xlibman+
-->QuoteBegin-xlibman+
| QUOTE (xlibman) |
| I think both parties are wrong, and I know he will understand. I do not like seeing fights like this in the community as this is making me very upset |
I fully agree. I let AlienCC know I fully agree. In fact, looking back on the conversation, I attacked him pretty hard, despite that not being my intention.
QuoteBegin-xlibman+
| QUOTE (xlibman) |
| I will not hold any grudge against him at all |
You seem to overstate your point of not holding a grudge. I'll personally hold a grudge against anyone who holds one against Leofox OR AlienCC. Honestly, we're all human, we all make mistakes.
QuoteBegin-leofox+
| QUOTE (leofox) |
| but you can understand why i can't go back to UTI anymore. |
Actually, I don't. You were punished unfairly by one of the admins, not by the entire community there. I personally would hate to see you leave. UTI isn't the admins, it's the community the admins are supposed to protect.
Post by: threefingeredguy on August 26, 2006, 04:06:00 pm
Post by: NETWiz on August 26, 2006, 06:37:00 pm
We at United-TI regret every having to ban anyone who is a part of our community. As a matter of fact, Leofox was almost chosen as a UTI-STAFF member at one time. With that in mind, Leofox has always been a very active member, with a positive attitude, and a great deal of seniority. We like having Leofox on our team.
The problem begun with Leofox saying things like, ?yeah me too, but I don?t put my *** in them?? and ?yiff in hell.? We quite simply cannot have this type of chat on United-TI or anywhere on the forums because our audience is Children, Teenagers, Students, Teachers, and Parents. It is most definite an attack against someone in a sexual manner and highly against our rules. With that said, we can understand that Leofox got upset about the kicks and later the ban. This was an attempt to let him know he had crossed the line and request he walk back over to the right side. Perhaps this situation was handled wrong on our behalf. Maybe we should try contacting the individual in the future.
To everyone at #unitedti, if kicked consider it a severe warning, but don?t get angry. Just re-join immediately and correct the behavior problem. Kicking is just to show the severity of the problem. I too have been kicked and banned before in a different IRC chartroom, so I know how it makes you feel. I was angry when I got kicked in a different room and I was later banned. I was beyond angry, but reflecting upon it makes me think how it was my fault.
As for being mad, angry, drunk, and tired, we do not care provided you maintain the highest level of deportment in the United-TI venue. We will not accept any of the above excuses as a valid reason to break our rules or attack another member. As far as not knowing that SQLdemon was AlienCC, it does not matter either because we will not tolerate this lack of respect against anyone on the forum or on #unitedti regardless of who they are.
With the admission of doing bad stuff, you have already taken the first step towards behavior modification. The United-TI community tends to agree that 21 days is a long time, but the #unitedti administrators do it to send a message to everyone and be strict. Please do not take it personally. The community also agrees that you did nothing wrong on the UTI forums and that you are a very active member with a paid subscription. For these things, you are appreciated and looked up upon by many. I have already removed the IP ban, so you no longer need a proxy to view the website. That was just silly on my part really. If you do come back to United-TI, we will extend your paid subscription for every day you were banned. Jon has also moved the topic into a forum only accessible to UTI-STAFF.
In my personal dealings with AlienCC, I realize he is a very easy-going and understanding guy. I have had the honor of working with him for a very long time and he is a very large part of United-TI. He is very talented and busy person in all aspects of life. He still manages to do the daunting and insurmountable tasks. All I should say is that he is under a great deal of stress working on a large project and in college doing more units that most students. AlienCC is actually taking about 3 calender-weeks off for College and to work on a large project. Everybody, please wish him luck.
United-TI has a good set of checks and balances that sometimes take a great deal of time to work. All I can say is that with AlienCC taking some time off I will be arbitrating this situation. We all need to take 100% responsibility for our actions, so I think deep down inside you and I both know what we each have to do. I am going to PM you privately on this forum. I have almost nothing at all to do with the #unitedti IRC chartroom. I am only given +oa out of respect quite honestly just like David L. is the highest level UTI Staff and always will be out of respect. With that said, AlienCC deserves the utmost respect in regards to United-TI.
The entire United-TI community would hate to see you leave forever as we all (AlienCC) consider the matter (including #unitedti) closed and after 21 days. We all just want to forget and move on with other more important matters such as the United-TI upgrades planned in the near future. I will personally admit that this whole situation got blown out of hand by the United-TI administration including myself who banned Leofox in the forums. Regardless, I am sending a PM now in an effort to resolve settle this dispute quicker.
It is obviously your choice whether or not you want to come back, but speaking personally, I will miss you if you leave us.
Thank you for your time.
-NETWiz
Post by: spengo on August 26, 2006, 08:19:00 pm
Anyways all I can say is say sorry and make up with pplz and try to get everyone happy again. Obviously it wasn't all one person's fault, but the question remains who will be the most mature dude and make up first.
Post by: leofox on August 27, 2006, 12:19:00 am
QuoteBegin-netwiz+-->
| QUOTE (netwiz) |
| As for being mad, angry, drunk, and tired |
I was never saying that as an excuse. I should've just left the channel and go to sleep, instead of arguing with everyone 'til 3 AM.
QuoteBegin
-->QuoteBegin
| QUOTE |
| Actually, I don't. You were punished unfairly by one of the admins, not by the entire community there. I personally would hate to see you leave. UTI isn't the admins, it's the community the admins are supposed to protect. |
Jon isn't just an admin, he maintains the server and spends a lot of free time and money on UTI. It's very hard to not take notice of him.
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 27, 2006, 01:48:00 am
Note that I still respect all the hard work put in UnitedTI community and I am amazed by how it became successful, my leaving is just to protect myself and the others, as I tend to have very serious self control problems and when I see a small argument I go overboard
Post by: katmaster on August 27, 2006, 03:39:00 am
Post by: Zeromus on August 27, 2006, 07:35:00 am
| QUOTE ("threefingeredguy") |
| Nobody likes Toksyurel anyway. |
I rather enjoy >90% of the conversations I have with Toksy. By saying that you are implying that I don't like him? That isn't exactally right.
--==--
On a related note, this will probably be my last post here on the forums. I have been asked nicely to leave the forums, the channel, and not PM/Msg xlibman again in the future. I am sorry for anyone that only comes here and still looks forward to my posts and me being in the channel (someone has to mod there, I popped in and there where 3 unvoiced members that needed voice! ^.^) but since he asked me I will comply.
--==--
@ leofox. While I do not agree with what you did in the chan, I also do not agree with what AlienCC did. Though I can see his point in what he did, it was a bit severe. I probably would have done the same thing thought (I was a good deal offended that night) and honestally I am sotty one of the mods there (including myself) didn't remove you from the channel sooner to avoid this mess.
Post by: katmaster on August 27, 2006, 01:00:00 pm
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 27, 2006, 02:10:00 pm
he will be back
Post by: elfprince13 on August 27, 2006, 02:24:00 pm
what happened?
Post by: Darth Android on August 28, 2006, 01:20:00 am
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 28, 2006, 03:53:00 am
| QUOTE (unitedti irc chan) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| [10:50:51] Post by: the_unknown_one on August 28, 2006, 04:08:00 am
I've always supported you and I never wanted you to leave, but at the moment i'm just sick of your attitude towards people and your behaviour. Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 28, 2006, 04:09:00 am
Post by: katmaster on August 28, 2006, 09:04:00 pm Post by: leofox on August 29, 2006, 03:21:00 am Post by: arcane wizard on August 29, 2006, 06:25:00 am
Not entirely leo, you've been very 4chan-ish for a while before that and I believe that has been part of the reasons for decisions made later. This concern was relayed to me by AlienCC as well as several other regulars, and we also noted this to you in the channel. -->This was a concern you neglegted, because.. QuoteBegin
4chan "humor" is offensive. Not only to it's target like you where targetting furries, but also to whoever has any respect for the people the target comprises. And certainly to people on a network with families and working relations to respect. -->After your fair share of warnings, you said that it's just humor. Well it isn't, because you are dealing with people here, and you have to learn that this kind of "humor" has very little place outside of internet sites like 4chan and that these people including me do not deserve to be surrounded by such behaviour. There are many aspects to your behaviour that day and the days before it that drew concerns. For example.. QuoteBegin
you don't just ignore a warning because you've been entrusted the ability to override it. Just like toks would've been able to remove his ban had you banned him, but should at least respect you that you may have a reason to. -->QuoteBegin
Another thing I was trying to attent you to before, was that you shouldn't behave to people just because they're regular x or y, not that that prevented you later on. Also non-regulars deserve a matter of respect in the channel that is not evident in 4chan like behaviour. -->QuoteBegin
Another thing I was pointing your attention to before you got banned. Disregarding those concerns and warnings is observed as a very serious matter. And the presence of 4chan like places elsewhere on the internet is not a reason to expect people to stay out of what should be respectfull places where work friendly environements are actively being enforced and have always been actively enforced by me and others. -->All this together and more, which is obvious to you, represented your behaviour and what further consequences where based on. QuoteBegin
I will say you where an example, but the concerns for doing this multisided ban in a way are in my eyes valid. In fact, I believe there are now signs, also outside of your case, as well as cases in the history of United TI that an even heavyer point must be drawn on respectfull behaviour both on the uti forums and the irc channel. Which the posting of the events was supposed to address. Apparently everybody is being too busy being offended and not getting the point to learn how to fit in a better image of United TI. Like I said, your behaviour as a whole is always what drives other people to serious actions, not a single event, and I believe that there where also concerns on your forum behaviour as of late. Concerns I personally also expressed to you that evening in that irc channel. -->Apparently you also disregarded that, since you don't seem to know this. QuoteBegin
I find this inaccurate. For one thing, the logs are always and have always been public. For another thing, you where not blamed for anything you haven't actually done, so any consequences from stating what your actions where are entirely your own fault and cannot be dismissed as simple bad mouthing. Knowing that, what do you think this is? Or actually, should've been taken by you as such before you went too far? A lesson. And with that public post it is also a lesson to everybody else. -->QuoteBegin
I think I do, which is why I am (and was) trying to give you an understanding of the bigger picture.
AlienCC isn't trying to badmouth you, like I said, only your observed behaviour has been noted. Behaviour you must take responsibility for, behaviour everybody "bad" mouthing you in that topic wants you to improve and help you with where possible, like I am trying to now. Behaviour you have been given 21 days to think of a way of improving, of which 20% have already passed. And your timeout will pass, but where it goes from there is entirely up to you. I will now double post some responses I value to later events, in this topic, that are seperate from my advise or observations presented to you. Hence, mods, admins, please forgive my postcount increasing by a whole other post, it's for a reason. (will it even fit in one post????) Post by: arcane wizard on August 29, 2006, 06:41:00 am
I agree, to a point. UTI is also a vision shared (or should be) by it's staff. A vision that is made possible to those who wish to share it, and those who do not may have enforced periods of reassessing their attitude.
I find it strange I seem to be the only one who has gotten promoted to staff and understands this, as well as pursues/d it. Even though it has been present since even before I was staff, and certainly afterwards with the increased emphasis on the irc channel being just as much a part of uti as it's forums or the pages around it. I guess that's all, anything else I want to say is just going to be taking the wrong way by overprotective and easily offended people here. Let's just say I'm more than disappointed in people who wheren't even there, or I've even heard of before, more so than I am with leofox. Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 29, 2006, 10:37:00 am QuoteBegin-arcane wizard+29 Aug, 2006, 13:41-->
that is meant as an attack toward me I'm sure, have you ever realised that there is reasons why I became overprotective, and that I didnt wanted to be like that, seeing all the trouble this cause? I jsut cant do anything about it, I tried. Please be more understanding. It is true that in overall on Omnimaga people are more sensitive (there are exceptions of course) and more understanding about others, and this is something most other forums doesn't have (again, there is exceptions). There is people who hate us because of this and fail to see the good side of it, as well as what the members of the group provide to the community. Usually the people who think that way rarely had to go through all the crap some people here went through. Lately I understand I have been a real nuisance to the other channels, I went mad because of the leofox incident and posted flames toward the entire UTI staff in the UTI channel and even besides that incident I tended to become very upset for no reason, and often did stuff that I wouldnt do normally, like when I said to CDI to not come back (which I apologised for to CDI). I am sorry for all the trouble I've caused, and if it would be best for me to leave, tell me, I will. Just understand that I havent been in a very good mood lately and that I have been overly depressed. It is not easy to deal with this when at the same time you have fights at home and family problems (people causing trouble to my mother, court stuff, etc). SOme of you may have read my long post on the old forums, MC or UTI which talked about this. It cooled down a few months ago, but now it started all again Post by: arcane wizard on August 29, 2006, 11:25:00 am
Well mostly others actually, because any time I question anybody's authority or actions, however objective or fact-based I present my case, I just get some kind of lynching mob after me. -->I know your history, I know how you react to things, and I'm fine with you. It's just the large mobs who aren't even around when things occur but then blindly attack someone, who was there and questions their idols, instead of actually reading or absorbing the message that person has. QuoteBegin
I understand it from you, but you actually present your own opinion, and I've always ofered my help and understanding to you when I could.
You where only banned for a couple of minutes so you couldn't but stop. : P Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 29, 2006, 12:13:00 pm  , I see it wasnt
Post by: arcane wizard on August 29, 2006, 12:39:00 pm Sorry. Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 29, 2006, 12:43:00 pm and sry about that. Sometimes when someone try to help me i seems to ignore almost everything, and later i realise all the support that person given me, now this is why when online stuff related I often read my old IRC/AIM logs again
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on August 30, 2006, 09:27:00 am I hope the people realise that AlienCC didnt posted the leofox topic to public to start a "throw mud at leofox" discussion, but to show the reward someone get to break the rules like this, which is in this case, the 21 day ban. From what I heard UTI IRC channel is very integrated into the forums to their beliefs, as most people are similar. The people may have different opinion about this and we have to respect their choice as well. This is why AlienCC chosen to ban on both. Leofox learned his lesson with the ban, and no grudges should be held against him if he decides to come back at Unitedti. We all do mistakes in life. No grudges should be held toward aliencc and UTI staff by the people who disagreed with AlienCC either. If this is how they deal with such situations this is their choice, and we have to respect them, even though you don't necessarly support it or not (like how ASM programmers should respect BASIC programmers for their language choice or vice versa). I personally didnt supported it at first, because i misinterpreted aliencc behaviour, like lot of ppl did, but later I realised they have to do what they have to do. Rules are different on most forums. On Tcpa this would have been deal differently, on Omnimaga as well. From now on I hope AlienCC reconsiders his decision of leaving the community, and I hope the topic on UTI will not be used in the future in malicious way. |