Omnimaga

General Discussion => Technology and Development => Other => Topic started by: Spyro543 on August 05, 2014, 04:23:46 pm

Title: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 05, 2014, 04:23:46 pm
This is the first time I ever tried organizing a parts list for building a PC. I want it to be able to run most games at medium graphics settings (especially Minecraft), and for emulation.
Here's the part list:


PCPartPicker part list (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2gXsVn) / Price breakdown by merchant (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2gXsVn/by_merchant/)


CPU: Intel Core i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core Processor (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646i34150)  ($109.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: ASRock B85 Pro4 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asrock-motherboard-b85pro4)  ($79.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Kingston 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/kingston-memory-khx1600c10d3b18g)  ($69.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Toshiba Product Series:DT01ACA 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/toshiba-internal-hard-drive-hdkpc03)  ($54.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 750 2GB Video Card (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn750oc2gi)  ($109.99 @ Newegg)
Case: NZXT Source 220 ATX Mid Tower Case (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/nzxt-case-caso22001)  ($44.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: EVGA 600B 600W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-power-supply-100b10600kr)  ($44.99 @ NCIX US)
Total: $514.92
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-06 16:56 EDT-0400
Will this be enough to do what I want?


EDIT: I haven't actually ordered anything, so please critique!
EDIT 2: My budget is about $500.
EDIT 3: Updated part list.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Keoni29 on August 05, 2014, 04:39:31 pm
This can do everything you want and more :P
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 05, 2014, 04:56:42 pm
Yep. If I were you I'd grab a beefier PSU for future upgrades (at least 700W) and a GTX7xx GPU. Besides that it sounds pretty good. You may want  1TB HDD too, they're not much more expensive and it's a nice to have.

Oh and if the i3 supports dual channel change your mobo for one that does and choose a 2x 4GB RAM kit. It'd be too bad to waste some performance there. This PC should be able to run Dolphin just fine for most games as well.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Keoni29 on August 05, 2014, 04:59:46 pm
If you want to put a lot of games on it it's certainly advised. Most games are 10GB> these days.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 05, 2014, 06:02:19 pm
a GTX7xx GPU
So, something like this? (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn750oc2gi) It's actually cheaper than the GTX 650 I chose.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 05, 2014, 06:06:50 pm
Actually don't bother. The GTX 650 and 750 are apparently the same.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Sorunome on August 05, 2014, 06:08:03 pm
I have a server CPU in my comp and i like it :3
let all the GPU handle all the graphics stuff
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: CalebHansberry on August 05, 2014, 06:09:15 pm
Good advice Soru, could look into a Xeon CPU.

And yeah, just get whatever's cheapest :P
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 05, 2014, 06:10:40 pm
Lol Xeon is not made just for servers, there are models with an IGP. It's just that they are slightly better than i5/i7's. And yes, never use the Intel IGP.

Oh actually, do Xeons have overclocking unlocked ?
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Sorunome on August 05, 2014, 06:11:27 pm
Good advice Soru, could look into a Xeon CPU.

And yeah, just get whatever's cheapest :P
Yeah, i have a xeon e1230v3. It is some quad core with hyperthreading, pretty awesome. And it has socket 1150, so there are also quite some mobos to pick from. I got my CPU for 200€ back then, just checked and the price increased a bit :P (or inflation)
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 05, 2014, 09:58:35 pm
CPU: Intel Core i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core Processor (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646i34150)  ($109.98 @ SuperBiiz)

Around that price point, that seems to be the current clear leader in performance for the value.

Alternatively, if you want to save about 40% of the price and only give up about 20% of the performance, keep in mind that Intel still makes Pentiums (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646g3258)!

Memory: Kingston 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/kingston-memory-khx1600c10d3b18g)  ($69.99 @ Amazon)

If that price stays there, that's great value. Although, as others have said, you'd theoretically get better performance out of 2x4GB than 1x8GB due to dual channel stuffs. So if prices change such that a 1600MHz 4x2GB kit costs the same or less, I'd grab that instead.

Storage: Hitachi Deskstar 750GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/hitachi-internal-hard-drive-hds721010kla330)  ($59.99 @ Amazon)

You might want to shop this one around a bit, as I can see 1TB drives around that price, so there might be some room to "optimize" the price of this.

Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 650 2GB Video Card (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn650oc2gi)  ($117.99 @ Amazon)

As Streetwalrus hinted at, I'd look into replacing that with a GTX 750. It should perform better, and may even be cheaper.

As for the rest of the parts, I can't offer much intuition. Although I know a fair bit about the actual computing parts, I don't know much about the more foundation parts, like motherboard and power supply.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 05, 2014, 10:31:42 pm
Storage: Hitachi Deskstar 750GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/hitachi-internal-hard-drive-hds721010kla330)  ($59.99 @ Amazon)

You might want to shop this one around a bit, as I can see 1TB drives around that price, so there might be some room to "optimize" the price of this.
I did find a 1TB drive for the same price: Link (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/toshiba-internal-hard-drive-hdkpc03)

Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 650 2GB Video Card (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn650oc2gi)  ($117.99 @ Amazon)

As Streetwalrus hinted at, I'd look into replacing that with a GTX 750. It should perform better, and may even be cheaper.
I'll take a look at this. Thanks for the help :)
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 06, 2014, 05:14:19 am
Keep in mind that for 2x 4GB you need a dual channel motherboard, yours is single channel.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 06, 2014, 09:51:25 am
Keep in mind that for 2x 4GB you need a dual channel motherboard, yours is single channel.
Does that mean that if I were to get 2 or more RAM sticks, the the RAM wouldn't perform as well? Sorry, I don't really know these things :P
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 06, 2014, 10:16:06 am
Dual channel is kind of dual core ram if you will. In other words you can access both sticks simultaneously instead of having a bigger contiguous ram pool.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 06, 2014, 12:36:16 pm
I admittedly don't know much about motherboards, but kis there anything wrong with the cheapest motherboard available, the H81M? It's only about $50 and most of the features is lacks shouldn't matter for this build (like 4 RAM slots, crossfire support, extra SATA ports). It even seems to support dual channel memory accesses.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: willrandship on August 06, 2014, 03:33:40 pm
While that is true, it is less useful than it sounds for single-core performance. All modern OSes I know of use RAM pages, which allocate* blocks of the sticks of RAM for usage in program. If you need an address outside the currently allocated space, it performs what's called a page fault (not an error, more like a garbage collect) and allocates the needed block. This means the program has to wait until that block is allocated.

The only case where dual-channel memory helps in this scenario are TWO programs getting a page fault at the same time. Not just two programs using memory, but two programs happening to need non-allocated memory at the same time.

On the other hand, as far as page fault time usage is concerned, Linux uses about 30% of its CPU time dealing with page faults. So, the performance difference for multiple RAM-heavy threads will be noticeable, but it won't be double. It might be 8-10% faster in that specific scenario.

One stick of 8GB RAM is cheaper. Is the extra cost worth the slight bit of extra performance, and the inability to do a partial upgrade later? (ie buy another 8GB stick and get 16GB total, rather than buying 2 8GB sticks later to swap out the 2 4GB sticks)

*in this case, allocation refers to either copying the block of RAM into the CPU cache, or letting the MMU do some magic. It's not referring to malloc() or new() stuff, although those can easily cause page faults.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 06, 2014, 03:57:43 pm
I admittedly don't know much about motherboards, but kis there anything wrong with the cheapest motherboard available, the H81M? It's only about $50 and most of the features is lacks shouldn't matter for this build (like 4 RAM slots, crossfire support, extra SATA ports). It even seems to support dual channel memory accesses.
That one is only a Micro ATX, and I need an ATX motherboard. The H81 Pro looks like it's an ATX version of the H81M, so I might consider that one.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 06, 2014, 04:14:04 pm
That one is only a Micro ATX, and I need an ATX motherboard. The H81 Pro looks like it's an ATX version of the H81M, so I might consider that one.

Partly for my education: why would one prefer an ATX motherboard over micro ATX? I know you'd have to switch cases too, but is that the only tradeoff?
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 06, 2014, 04:37:16 pm
That one is only a Micro ATX, and I need an ATX motherboard. The H81 Pro looks like it's an ATX version of the H81M, so I might consider that one.

Partly for my education: why would one prefer an ATX motherboard over micro ATX? I know you'd have to switch cases too, but is that the only tradeoff?
I'm not sure really, this is the first time I ever even thought about building a computer :P I think the only reason is the case, but I'm not sure.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 07, 2014, 12:54:06 am
Any board will fit in an ATX case. In a mATX case you need a mATX board or mini ITX. For Mini ITX, only mini ITX boardd will fit. But if you have a larger case, then don't limit yourself to a smaller board, IR you won't be able to expand the machine.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 07, 2014, 12:24:25 pm

Any board will fit in an ATX case. In a mATX case you need a mATX board or mini ITX. For Mini ITX, only mini ITX boardd will fit. But if you have a larger case, then don't limit yourself to a smaller board, IR you won't be able to expand the machine.
Thanks for the explanation. I really dont know much about this. :P would you recommend the H81M or H81 over what I currently have picked?
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Streetwalrus on August 07, 2014, 06:30:18 pm
If you have a full size case, take the full size board.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 07, 2014, 06:33:54 pm
If you have a full size case, take the full size board.

The H81 is more expensive than the H81M. What benefits does having the larger version offer (if any)?
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: willrandship on August 07, 2014, 06:39:31 pm
Besides, it's easier to install smaller motherboards in bigger cases. The screw holes will still line up, and you'll have more room to work with.
Title: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 07, 2014, 09:52:36 pm
Besides, it's easier to install smaller motherboards in bigger cases. The screw holes will still line up, and you'll have more room to work with.
So you would recommend the H81M? It certainly would save me some money. It has fewer RAM slots, USB ports, and SATA ports, but still has enough for this build.
Spoiler For Chart I found about motherboard chipsets:
(http://www.ukgamingcomputers.co.uk/images/articles/h81vsb85.jpg)
Also, the case I picked is compatible with micro ATX boards.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: willrandship on August 12, 2014, 09:57:35 pm
In my experience by the time you upgrade you want to replace the whole thing anyway, but then again, I am a cheapskate. I say go for the H81M.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 21, 2014, 06:49:33 pm
So I changed the part list a tiny bit (different HDD, PSU, and better graphics card).
I also ordered the case, motherboard, and PSU. I got the case and PSU a couple days ago, but the motherboard just arrived in Ohio, so it should be here in a couple days.

PCPartPicker part list (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/vmWJpg) / Price breakdown by merchant (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/vmWJpg/by_merchant/)

CPU: Intel Core i3-4130 3.4GHz Dual-Core Processor (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646i34130)  ($118.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: ASRock B85 Pro4 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asrock-motherboard-b85pro4)  ($69.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Kingston 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/kingston-memory-khx1600c10d3b18g)  ($83.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seagate-internal-hard-drive-st1000dm003)  ($51.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 750 Ti 2GB Video Card (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-video-card-02gp43751kr)  ($131.98 @ Newegg)
Case: NZXT Source 220 ATX Mid Tower Case (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/nzxt-case-caso22001)  ($44.99 @ TigerDirect)
Power Supply: EVGA 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-power-supply-100b10500kr)  ($29.99 @ NCIX US)
Total: $531.90
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-21 18:45 EDT-0400
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 21, 2014, 07:16:33 pm
Why did you downgrade the CPU from 4150 to 4130? Although prices fluctuate, it seems that you can get the 4150 for the same price or even cheaper than the 4130 on average.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 21, 2014, 07:46:34 pm
Why did you downgrade the CPU from 4150 to 4130? Although prices fluctuate, it seems that you can get the 4150 for the same price or even cheaper than the 4130 on average.
I'm not sure if I will have to or not. It all depends on what BIOS version my motherboard has. When it comes I'll be able to check it (it has a little sticker on it with BIOS info). If it has version 2, I can get the 4150.
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Runer112 on August 21, 2014, 08:11:45 pm
I'm not sure if I will have to or not. It all depends on what BIOS version my motherboard has. When it comes I'll be able to check it (it has a little sticker on it with BIOS info). If it has version 2, I can get the 4150.

As far as I can tell from Intel's site, the two processors are functionally identical except for the slightly higher clock speed of the 4150. What am I missing?
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 21, 2014, 08:18:00 pm
I'm not sure if I will have to or not. It all depends on what BIOS version my motherboard has. When it comes I'll be able to check it (it has a little sticker on it with BIOS info). If it has version 2, I can get the 4150.

As far as I can tell from Intel's site, the two processors are functionally identical except for the slightly higher clock speed of the 4150. What am I missing?
The 4130 is a Haswell, while the 4150 is a Haswell Refresh (only the 2nd BIOS version can use these).
Title: Re: Looking to build a PC for emulation and gaming
Post by: Spyro543 on August 23, 2014, 11:22:58 am
I just got my motherboard and it has BIOS version 2, so I can get the 4150.