Omnimaga
Calculator Community => Other Calc-Related Projects and Ideas => Topic started by: willrandship on December 05, 2012, 04:42:04 am
-
Omni-RPG Main Thread
This thread is for discussing pretty much anything relating the the Omni-RPG community game. Sub threads currently are:
- Storyline (http://ourl.ca/17701)
- Battle Engine (http://ourl.ca/17702)
The Omnimaga RPG project is intended to be a community-created large scale project. That means anyone is eligible to help. There is some management by specific members to keep things organized, but there are still tons of things that other members can do.
-
Hmm. I could help a bit. I could write routines in Axe for use with basic.
-
Ah, yes, that's a good point. Axe would be perfect for writing small routines like menus, archiving tools, etc.
We could also have multiple builds if that's the case: AsmStub and Fusion
-
If done, in order to work out, it would need to be done the modern way, as in open source, using code repositories or project managers like big Linux projects, and such place would of course require the ability to submit images/sprites/etc, while this topic could be used to discuss ideas/progress. That way, it won't fail due to the only people who got the code or pics vanishing entirely or due to data losses. Also if someone loses interest and the entire story is already written, then it would be easier for newer people to take over.
Most team projects failed before due to poor planning, a teamate vanishing or the lack of good project management. Also to work out the best way it would most likely have to be Axe or BASIC (plus common libs, such as in xLIB, XCOPY or DCS). That way, more people can help out.
And yeah, even if the project is open source or easily accessible for people willing to help, it would still be good to assign certain people to specific tasks and familiarize themselves with the game variables/lists used and stuff.
-
Hmm. I agree with DJ_O that planning is a very important thing.
-
This sounds pretty cool.
Too bad the only thing I can do in basic is math :P
-
I could help with random hex codes or small asm programs. I worry about how much time I will have, though :/
-
If i have some time and if it's well organised, i could help some stuff, most of the time i can come up with a way to do something, but i'm one of the persons who can't optimize/decent use of routines xD
-
If I have time, might help with the story or something.
-
I could help too, preferably by coding, but I could try sprites or maps as well.
But I think it should be either mostly axe with small parts of basic, or fully axe, so that it will still work at a good speed. Also, I'd go for sprites instaed of dual-layes ASCII, because it's prettier.
If we want a bigger community, we shouldn't confirm the idea that calculator programming is slow and limited.
-
I agree with ben
Make it axe, faster, prettier + appvars or something...
-
I'll help if it's in axe/asm
-
Yay squidget ;p
If we go axe now, with the help of squidget, it will be an awesome game
-
I could sprite/design map.
-
I could do engine! (in axe)
-
I could do engine! (in axe)
What engine? Map engine? Move engine? Battle engine?
-
Move engine
-
I could help with the planning/story/etc. I don't know a thing about coding in Axe, but some of the content (Map making, etc) I could do.
-
I could give some things a try, i could try collisions/mapping/movement and some other stuff, just ask and i'll say if i can do that or if some one more pro should do
-
I could also help with story (actually, I'd prefer to do this)
-
Yeah i'm not very creative/writer xD
-
Well, if it's in axe it should still have separate source files (not hard, thanks to the prgm token) so that we can manage the project in a more group-like context. We would also need to share it as source, rather than compiled programs. I hope no one has an issue with that.
Does Axe support compiling programs whose source is larger than RAM fits, via archive?
-
I'm ok with that
And how do you mean?
Axe can compile sources that are archived...
-
And again, if there are any parts that need assembly optimising, I could do that.
I think that if each part of the game had its own source (battle engine, item reference, monsters, sprites, events, movement, and more), that would be the best option. This would allow us to figure out which part of the program to edit. If we have multiple people working on the same part of the program, we will need to communicate! Obviously, this would be via a topic (maybe a topic for each component, that way it isn't one cluttered topic) or somethiong similar.
I feel that in the best case scenario, a high-end game could be created in a week. This, however, would require heavy planning before hand, code would have to be planned, story, rules, items, and more. My best success with writing an RPG comes from going into it with a good idea of what I need to do next, so we should create a checklist of things to do.
-
Well, I was thinking that any part that gets assigned to a different person is its own source file.
And yes, assembly optimizations are very welcome, but they should probably wait until a given source file is completed, so we can track bugs to either the optimizations or the program itself.
Axe can compiled archived source? Good. That means that we can compile even if the program source ends up ridiculously large.
So, since the voting has been a big 'yes' I'll take it down for now. (18 votes in under 24 hours. wow.) I've set up a github repo. Who wants commit rights?
https://github.com/willrandship/Omnimaga-RPG (https://github.com/willrandship/Omnimaga-RPG)
-
We'll have to be extremely meticulous in documenting which areas of ram are used where. I ran into this issue in the old version of A:P, and with mutliple people working on it it could become a problem really quickly. Things as separate as the NPC engine, battle engine, and item system for example need to use completely separate areas of RAM, otherwise battles won't be able to be called from and return to NPC conversations, and items can't be used during battle, etc.
-
That's a good point. How about having a topic specifically dedicated to RAM usage in specific areas, along with the same info on github?
Oh, and when using github, make sure to branch. It makes things a lot easier to work with. For example, you can modify ALL the codebase without actually modifying the master code branch. Also, use changelogs. Detailed changelogs.
-
Ok all got good points, maybe it's also better to only use lists (L1, L2,...) when nescesarry, cause those can be hard to work with if it's coded by multiple people, cause if someone thinks he can use L2, but someone else need interupts...
-
We should also get a list of people contributing and to which areas they are working on to know who to collaborate with. I already have an interesting idea for a story in the works.
-
I would like to join but i'm rather new to axe :s and idk on what area i'dd want to work...
-
Indeed.
I'm thinking for the RAM access, it should be documented like so:
Free-use RAM (Anyone can use, but don't expect it to stick around)
dedicated RAM (for your area)
Specialty RAM (for example, the Screen RAM is a bit awkward) where you would have specific details following.
-
Is this gonna be BASIC still? If so, I could help. A while back I played around with axe, but I never got really advanced or anything. I probably forgot all of my axe knowledge. :P
-
I would like to join too.
-
Storyline, graphics, background areas will all be big areas. Don't worry.
You could also help manage the project if you'd like. I don't want to do everything :P
Posting a new poll on the storyline's setting. This will affect how the gameplay works, so I figured it should come first.
-
where can we subscribe? I mean, how can we subscribe/enter?
-
To the github repo? You'll need a github account, then I add you as a contributor.
Do you know how to use git?
-
I made an account... And no, i'm new to it... But i saw edit functions, new files... That's enough i think?xD
-
Err...Actually, that won't be enough. You need to access it via the git program. I'm assuming you're not so good with the command line, either, so you should probably stick with a GUI client like this. (http://windows.github.com/)
-
Just asking: Who is going to work on story (other than myself)?
-
Sounds like HOMER is, at least, and I'll probably suggest things occasionally.
-
I'm thinking, maybe for the theme a medieval/Sci Fi blend. Kind of like if medieval times had some advanced technology.
I'm thinking we should perhaps make a section for this or even a client forum for discussion on multiple aspects. (Also, the agreed story will affect the theme, so we might want to focus on that as well)
Edit: pimath, I am and possibly Juju if he has time it seems
-
Ok thx will
But i'm gonna sleep first
Tommorow a very hard exam of maths :o part 1 , so we have 2 exams of math :o
So goodnight , only 6h sleep left
-
Have fun.
I just wish there was an easy way to integrate sourcecoder with github.
-
Homer: I have a scenario that we could use (It's set in modern times)
The link: http://ourl.ca/17567
-
I also have an idea for one. Should we start another thread for storyline discussion?
-
Here, I'll start one. That way it'll be easier to track.
-
Yes we should!
-
Here it is: http://ourl.ca/17701/327293 (http://ourl.ca/17701/327293)
-
Ok, I just catched up on this project and didn't read everything before, but IMO we should do better graphics than ASCII art as axe makes it easy and axe is made by our community. I mean, here are a lot of axe programmers and you could do more awesome stuff then (4-level greyscale? :D, smooth scrolling etc.)
-
Yeah, I think that got decided along with the transition to Axe.
-
let's open up a poll! :D
-
There is already a poll :)
-
another poll >.>
-
More specific? (Apologies if I am posting too much.)
-
A poll wheather to use basic or axe
-
Axe would be faster and allow for more extensive memory usage. However, TI-Basic is more useful for numbers exceeding 65535, which we'll probably need.
-
well, it is still possible and i don't think we need to many numbers larger than 2 bytes, we'll probably have a runer on our side :P
-
>2 bytes for ridiculously high health for bosses, number of rickrolls, and XP. I think that's all we need.
-
that's not that much, well, for rickrolls we need over 9000 bytes, but we also have a runer on our side, maybe we can get him to add more-byte-variables :D
-
I highly doubt that anyone is going to collect that many rickrolls.
-
if you get a rickroll per frame?
-
65535 is pretty ridiculous for health if your max damage is only around 500. Numbers can be calibrated easily enough.
-
I know, but it's TI we're fighting. Also, the minimum damage might be 1, and stronger attacks will be magnitudes more powerful (due to taking more time).
-
Also for XP, you can merely store the amount of XP needed for next level up instead of storing total xp. Money is a possible-might-need-more-than-65535, but as will pointed out, numbers can be calibrated.
-
Is this still going to be in basic?
If so, I can't be of much help in programming, but I could do story and whatnot
And we gotta do Space! :P
-
It's going to be in Axe, from what people have been saying so far.
I'll make a programming thread. There, people can talk about gameplay, graphics (atl least until it gets its own thread), what language, etc.
-
I think this is a great idea will, and one I've been pondering recently myself. I think I'd personally be leaning towards AXE. The areas I'd be interested in are graphics, storyline, and project planning. *Edit* Oh, and of course helping with the most interesting part; the battle engine. :D
-
maybe this rpg should be added to the community projects and get it's own board?
-
It could eventually Sorunome. Lets give it a bit of time and see where it goes first. :)
-
Ok, that's true, now the fire is still burning, lol (I don't wanne know how much bandwidth the server needed today, lol)
-
I'd say it's bandwidth removed from the "TO 9000" threads. :P
And yeah, right now it's looking like everyone wants Axe. Who am I to complain? Xeda's even offering to help optimize code, which will be wonderful. (Imagine if no one optimized their code at all. It might be faster in BASIC :P)
And I agree: No board necessary until we know this is actually going somewhere. But at least I know what I'll be doing on Tuesdays!
-
I was wondering what kind of map system we will be using? This is one area where optimised assembly might be useful. Also, in almost all cases that we would need >16-bit math, it would be very easy in assembly or Axe. I have a few text display routines for 32-bit signed numbers ready and adding or subtracting won't be a problem (I hope Axe can detect carry, but regardless, it only takes a few bytes of ASM.
-
Right now it's looking like the standard top-down tiled maps.
-
Maybe we should get a list of who is participating in this project, and then we can add them to the wiki
-
- me
- epic7
- xeda
- willrandship
- homer-16
- spencboy
who else?
-
- me
- epic7
- xeda
- willrandship
- homer-16
- spencboy
who else?
Out of memory, Yeong and pimath.
I have a list in the readme file on git. The pull request has yet to be confirmed though
-
I confirmed it and added you as a collaborator. I think that means you won't need it confirmed anymore.
Anyone else who wants collaborator status, let me know.
-
May I participate?
-
of cource! :D
everybody who wants can
even if they can't program (storyline, sprites etc.)
-
The idea is that it's a community project, so ideally the majority of the community would participate at least a little.
-
added the list now, sorted alphabetically, to the mediawiki wiki
-
Poll for who the head writers should be. They will be the ones who make final decisions on the storyline. Let me know if someone should be on there who isn't.
-
there is a new big storyline idea, link is here:
http://epic7.cz.cc/omnirpg/index.php/Story_Proposals#Most_recent_mix_of_sorunome_homer_epic7_and_bb
-
So these are just the bosses of the writing dept. that make the final decisions, and not the only writers, correct?
-
So these are just the bosses of the writing dept. that make the final decisions, and not the only writers, correct?
these meaning you me homer and bb?
-
I think those are to make final decisions.
-
btw, the current collaborator list looks like this: http://epic7.cz.cc/omnirpg/index.php/Collaborators
if you wanne add you, do it, i sorted it alphabetically
-
I'll leave up the poll at least until tomorrow night. Give all the internationals a chance to vote.
-
good idea.
It seems atm like homer and me are winning :P
-
So there's gonna be 2?
-
i think so
-
I didn't even contribute to storyline and got 3 votes O.O
-
because you will be in it as the bridge keeper :P
-
Hm... Perhaps 1st and 2nd head, 3rd and 4th assistant, and any other be regular writer
And why is yeong beating me? I've been on irc for ideas for the past few hour :P
-
=.=
So I just read the storyline and I read about me not knowing what I'm doing. can it be fixed so that I'm intentionally evil? :P
-
Oh, and no, it will be 3. That way there will be no ties.
-
Ok, will do :D
Intentionel traitors are more awesome :P
-
maybe I'm just siding for my own reason? :P
-
nah, because you are the slave of the evil guy :P dunno, the reason is still to be discussed.
-
because people disrespect the bridge?
-
Nah, because of you trying to push everybody off the bridge because you want to have the bridge for you alone :P
-
Oh, and no, it will be 3. That way there will be no ties.
I don't see how it would prevent ties :P
-
ties in later voting once the three have been selected
-
... What?
-
ok. with 2 judge, 1 can vote and 1 can vote another. so make it 3 so majority can happen.
-
if you have three story bosses and they vote on some way how the story is they can never tie so there will always be a solution.
-
Hey i wanna code as well :o xD but i'm not able of being head coder, i'm so bad xp
-
I don't know yet how the coding will be structured, but it's probably going to have one or a few managers, assigning out tasks for others to accomplish. Also, there should be a system for making improvements to existing code from others.
-
Im browsing from my phone at the moment, so ill edit this post when i get home with details. I have sugesstions for how we could organize this project so we dont just have a bunch of people working on different things with no sense of direction.
*Edit*
Project lead: This person organizes the project and makes sure that everything is progressing. Makes sure that all groups are communicating. They should also be able to map out all the tasks that each group needs to be working on.
I would seperate the main project into 3 groups:
Programming team
Scenario team
Graphics team
The programming team is responsible for deciding the best way to implement game functions and programming them. IE: battle engine, object interactions item system, text system, level up system etc. etc. etc. The lead programmer should be proficient in AXE (since that is the primary language being used) and be able to delegate tasks.
The scenario team is responsible for writing the story and designing characters. When the story is done they need to be able to present a story board that maps out the course of the game. They are also responsible for writing all in game dialogue. The head of this team should be able to organize the story into a story board when its done and communicate information to the programming team.
Lastly, is the graphics team. They are responsible for bringing character designs to life and creating all the graphics for the game. It would be a big plus if the head of this team had a background in traditional art as well.
The key factor obviously will be that all groups are able to work independently when necessary, and communicate and work with one another to bring the whole project together.
*Edit2* We should also have a topic where each person interested in contributing lists their skill set so team leads can decide where to place them. Obviously some people will overlap and likely be used on more than one team. This way as the project that progresses people may join as well. I'd also recommend keeping topics open here so that people that wish to suggest things but not necessarily be a part of the main groups can do so.
-
Here's a new version of the world map I made.
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/93019118/omnimap.png)
And from the discussion we had last night, here is part of the general path that the player makes
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/93019118/omnimap%20path.png)
-
That looks awesome :D
Maybe switch C# and C++ around, since C# is closer to Java and C++ is an extension of C.
-
ahhhhhh... I can't figure out how to swap the text and not have the terrain look like crap... :P/me regrets putting text and terrain on same layer
-
Still looks impressive :o are we gonna make a world map on-calc as well? With the current location of the person?
-
/me is dying inside... *sniff*
also... I have no caps in my name, and it's misspelled
I want to share some of my work though, if that'll change anyone's mind:
Yes, they're poems, but I write prose as well...
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1S5nPJv6U8OM61NA3b9A57ct_8i5JZgReXjj32s5oErU/edit
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eLg-oFF5GsLFF7i081v4oju2cPSNc0Br204Hf-eb0H8/edit
And the one that did well in a contest:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WbHbb72F_b0gK5eOrK7MstABjPAM0Xms9oKnJraZGnY/edit
So yeah, you could say I'm a creative writer...
-
I'm sorry I spelled your name wrong. It was 4 in the morning. :P
-
Edited my post, please see above. :)
-
Lol, I organized the wiki page earlier today with a similar setup.
My categories were: Story dept., Design dept., and Programming dept. :P
Where would map designers fit into?
-
I suppose that would fall to scenario, but obviously, someone with graphic skills would need to bring it to life. :)
-
How does this look? (http://epic7.cz.cc/omnirpg/index.php?title=Collaborators)
-
I confirmed it and added you as a collaborator. I think that means you won't need it confirmed anymore.
Anyone else who wants collaborator status, let me know.
I will definetley help with spriting if nothing else, so you can add me. I'd also be interested in helping out with story (perhaps in an editor type capacity to ensure everything is correct and flows smoothly). I can also help with psuedocoding the battle engine when we get there.
Basically, I just restated everything I said in my initial post. :P
Examples of my sprite work:
http://ourl.ca/13507
*Edit* Looks good to me epic7. :)
-
You need a github account before I can add you to the git repo.
Also, it just occurred to me that doing this just before the christmas break may not have been the best idea :P
-
Yea, probably won't be much activity during the break, but ah well. :P
*edit*Joined as A0C since it wouldn't let me use underscores for some reason.....
-
Ok, you're added as a collaborator.
-
You need a github account before I can add you to the git repo.
Also, it just occurred to me that doing this just before the christmas break may not have been the best idea :P
Actually, in my case it came at just the right time. My semester is ending next week for the break and I'll have the next month completely free minus work :D
-
Lol, an extended period of time where there's no school and little work would, if anything, make me more productive :p
-
btw, github has the project being listed at omnimaga.com instead of omnimaga.org. :p
-
I fail. :P Chrome has spoiled me with its name autocompletion.
It's fixed now.
-
I think I can help for all sorts of code-based animations (I meant without too much sprites). I'm also good at heavy attacks animations such as lasers, explosions and this kind of things.
I also can help for coding (in Axe and ASM) :)
-
I could help with coding menus :P
-
I can help with coding anything that doesn't require that much axe knowledge :P
-
I have seen Sorunome's menus and I like them o.o Also, I started a little coding >.> I will be posting in the appropriate topic soon.
-
I have seen Sorunome's menus and I like them o.o Also, I started a little coding >.> I will be posting in the appropriate topic soon.
that means you vote for me making menus? *yay* thanks :D
-
I wanna help as well but nobody tells me what i could do ;( xp
But yeah i don't think i'dd be a huge help :/
But whatever, if you guys need someone to do something, i could always try to help
-
you could do sprite or map design or help with engine coding
-
Yes, I would vote for you, Sorunome :D And @stevon8ter: You might have fun trying to make graphical effects. Since this is an RPG that will likely incorporate magic, special effects will be useful :D
EDIT: Here is a screenie of my start to a scrolling map. It starts at 6MHz with a Pause 100 in the main loop, then I remove the Pause, then finally I show the scrolling at 15MHz. It is only doing left/right scrolling (more difficult and slower than up/down, I believe). It supports a variable size tilemap, but in the image, I think I have 16x13 with some simple 8x8 sprites. See the Coding discussion for other info.
(http://www.omnimaga.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=15107.0;attach=14232;image)
-
Oh no, please don't make this game run at 15MHz, think of my poor 83+ :P
/me wants this game too
Also, if you want to have more than 8k of executable, you can use both the CrabCake and my PageSwap axioms. The first one allows you to run programs up to 24k and the second one allows you to use subroutines you defined in an app (16k moar !). You can even use PageSwap with several apps, which is the number of apps times 16384 bytes of executable code !
For example, with CrabCake and one app, it's 40k of code that you can write.
But please don't use Fullrene, it only works on 84+ :P
-
The thing why apps are so awesome is that it doesn't require a shell to run it from archive.
-
That will be very useful O.O I forgot about your Axiom. I can start writing more optimised routines then and store them in an app! I could even add code so that if the user tries to run the app, it will start the main program instead :D
EDIT: And I was only showing 15MHz so that people could see what it looks like. It is about 1.75 times faster at scrolling on my actual calc.
-
But wouldn't that still require a shell then? D:
-
Yes, the program would require an app, but to be realistic, this program will probably get really big anyways. There is no way we will fit it all into RAM, so why not fit some of it into an App that is already in archive that we can add highly specific and optimsed code? I am sure we could fill the whole 16KB of space and leave almost no wasted room.
-
how about a app that loads appvars? all we'd have to fiddle into a app page is then the engins
-
You mean loading the appvars as programs? I did that with Grammer, so it is quite doable :)
-
i only thought of appvars storing data, but why not that? XD
-
Oh, okay. And I was thinking that using an app, I could write routines to directly access the data in archived appvars. This would help quite a bit with map data, tile data, and sprite data. I could maybe make a command to copy a sprite from archive to a location in RAM (that way it can be accessed by the main program).
-
That would be cool, as long as in-game engines still run fast :D
-
If I have 16KB to work with, I could make routines that can work directly with archive and do it quickly >.> It would technically be slower, but it probably wouldn't be noticeable.
-
That would be awesome, i'd say go for it! :D
-
I'll take this conversation over to the Coding topic, since it will be important for others.
-
@ xeda : i'm not good with graphical stuff :s
-
how about map designing? So just positioning stuff?
-
Yeah idk
I'll see about that , if i ever feel like designing xD i prefer to code but ok i'll help design levels if my help is needed there (tho i think some of the guys already created maps and they already have design in their head)
-
you can always help with coding and optimizing
-
But that's the point... I'm rather new to axe, bad at optimising, and my routines are probably slower
And we already have a lot of experienced axe programmers
-
Then collect ideas, like item stuff etc.
-
Yeah ok
But got to sleep now, already 2am :o
-
Umm... perhaps we could have randomly generated maps? It would take more coding, but if everything can fit in a 16K app, then I'd like to see that feature!
-
but you could achieve IMO a lot more awesomeness with non-random generated maps.
-
but you could achieve IMO a lot more awesomeness with non-random generated maps.
Do you care to elaborate/explain?
-
but you could achieve IMO a lot more awesomeness with non-random generated maps.
Do you care to elaborate/explain?
Well, if it is random generated it probably won't be so realistic as that stuff is so complex, and then it might be impossible to find some secrets, with fixed maps you can set every secrets etc. and have just a far larger control over it, while playing you can also exchange better with other people and last all other rpgs have also fixed maps.
-
Agreed. It wouldn't be worth it to make a random generator, and I think it would take away from the game
-
plus, how can randomness fit into a fixed storyline?
-
Yeah, that's the main reason
-
I have a story-line that I could suggest. So there's this kid, and his parents get killed by this guy wearing a metal mask. And you are the kid, so you have to kill the dude in the metal mask. So you get strong and go to kill that guy in the metal mask. You kill him and he says "I am to strong for me". You then realise that you are the metal mask man. So to make sure the metal mask man never exists you try to stop your self. So for the rest of the game you try to stop your self. So you go back in time, then try to stop yourself. So you go into your house, and your parents try to defend you, you kill them in self defence, and then you run off and try other ways to stop yourself. In the end you end up killing your younger self as the final boss. But when you try to kill him you end up causing a time paradox and you(Older self) end up dead. Any questions?
-
Need sprites?
-
@Augs nice one, this'll need a lot of animations indeed :D
-
What the paradox? O.O
-
his the older self kills the younger self, he can't be alive since he was killed in the past. But if he doesn't exist then he could have never been killed so he is alive but he can't because... it can't be solved in other words.
Ninja edit: More info here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporal_paradox
-
I know what a paradox is, but obviously that story is pretty confusing :P
-
Why would he kill his former self?
-
Self defence as he is trying to kill you. Also to his parents from dying. I forgot to say that he wears the metal mask to hide the fact that he is himself.
-
See how confusing this is?
-
I know it is confusing but I find it more intelligent than other cheesy story lines. Like bad guy causing rain of terror, good guy comes and solves it by killing the "guardians" so he can get to the main bad guy and kill him and he does so. The end.
Or maybe It's just me liking time travel.
-
About every cartoon/sitcom rpg series involved time travel at least once.
-
That is true. But, most of the time, they are different from each other.
-
Doesn't storyline has to be discussed in the storyline topic?
Btw: i actually like the story, though it might need some more elements, maybe the secret quardians of time (that's us, the omnimagans ?)
-
Will there be omnimaga users in the game as characters? o.O (slowpoke?)
-
I call that n00b rival that is required by all games ;D
-
I think we are concidering having like 12 members in it (as good guys, there also need to be some vilains and other characters...)
-
Guardians of time is way to cheesy. Maybe Zelda kind of thing where you go into dungeons to get the weapon and get stronger. Then when strong enough you just go and fight the main bad guy.
Sorry, I will go into the story line topic.
-
In that case, that upcoming extra who gets more speaking parts than the other extras!
-
Yeah ok xD
And idk, i was just making a half-asleep idea xD
-
Will we have a own subboard under community projects?
I think it should hav eone as it is so big :P
-
Yeah, you guys probably will get one once some more concrete progress has been made :)
-
Yeah, it's still at that iffy stage where everyone could lose interest.
-
Not losing interest... I'm for going forth!
-
Well, of course, but we really don't need our own forum board yet, that's all.
-
We actually need to come up with something since I feel I'll be losing interest already.
-
What do you mean? Story development is in full swing, and If you look at the battle engine thread there's quite a bit going on there.
-
Yes. I mean we should decide on the battle engine so I can start to work on it.
-
Turn based is easier to implement in basic and action is easier to implement in axe or asm, so it depends on the programming language as well.
-
Also, turn-based allows for lots of fancy effects and whatnot.
And at this point it's definitely Axe+Asm
-
Also, turn-based allows for lots of fancy effects and whatnot.
And at this point it's definitely Axe+Asm
(btw this might belong in the battle engine topic but whatever)
Yeah that's true, for example mystery dungeon has lots of effects with the moves.
-
One thing we should do: Make it so it's easy to reuse the code in other projects. Imagine if we had something like RPG Maker for calcs :P
-
Am I allowed to join in somehow? I doubt I'll start intervening with the code, since I guess enough people are interested(?)
Perhaps I could help with sprites, storyline, small snippets of code,....
Also I saw that on Google docs there was a document about this project free to edit. Isn't that pretty unsafe with all the trolls nowadays?
-
Well, sure! Just join in on the conversations, look for things to do, etc.
Google Docs has revision history, so it's easy to reverse problems caused by trolls.
-
Is this dead? I hope not. I was looking forward to this. :P
-
Yea, I think it's pretty much dead. It didn't have enough direction.
-
Unless you do some serious organization and some serious motivation it is dead :(
-
IIRC, I still have the battle engine (not done) source backup, so I can continue it after I finish IkarugaX.
-
Yeah, I still come back to it from time to time. If I ever release my tilemap library thingy, it might make development easier. I use the same engine here:
(http://img.ourl.ca/AmberBetaEx8.gif)
Again, that is 6MHz, but I do have a screenshot where I toggle 15MHz mode in it:
(http://img.ourl.ca//AmberBetaEx9FastMode.gif)
-
It is close to impossible to keep a calculator project alive unless only one person works on it.
This looked cool, though. I wish someone would continue this.
-
We already have a basic storyline, so tiles and programming seem to be the two main things needed right now.
-
Some programming is done, if you look at xedas post.
But yeah, still a lot of programming left....
-
We already have a basic storyline, so tiles and programming seem to be the two main things needed right now.
I'll try some sprites later to try to keep it alive (it's like a fire that is almost out and you're trying to find twigs and stuff for it :P).
-
Actually, the biggest thing this project needs is a project head. It needs someone willing to organize it and keep everyone moving and on the same page. Someone who is able to make final decisions on things and keep the project on track. Without organization you have a lot of people all trying to add to it, but each with their own desires. If things aren't kept organized and focused the whole thing loses direction and collapses in on itself. I'd say find that person. Then people can be grouped into what skill sets they have and what needs to be done. Then you can actually start to have real progress.
-
The problem, though, is if the project lasts like 3 months or longer, will the head programmer remain interested in calc dev for that long? Many people start calc programming then quickly lose interest for some reason.
This is why I always felt that if a project was going to be a team one, that only one single person should work on the code and that all the sprites should be done as early as possible into development. Else it falls apart easily compared to solo projects. I mean, why has The Reign of Legends 3 only took 6 months to complete as a solo project when all team projects of similar size never came close to being finished? ???
-
Another problem is the lack of easy inter-person development. The languages aren't designed for it, but that's mainly because the calculators aren't suited for it. Every time you want to update your code, you have to hook into a computer and manually add the new files, and if you've made your own changes to the same files you have to consolidate them. (And no programming language available for the calcs makes this easy.)
On PC-side development, synchronizing development work is as easy as (insert svn/git/hg sync command here) and it easily branches into several different development areas, but for calculators such methods are not really an option.
(Please don't misunderstand. Axe and Grammer are great, but they're designed for a platform that's not a great choice for community programming. Maybe calcnet could get something going, but size is still a limiting factor.)
Also, I'm a terrible project leader. ;) I don't work consistently on any one project, so I don't manage them well enough for others to do so.
-
Yeah that's a problem as well. Of course we can write our code on the computer but testing calculator programs is cumbersome due to having to switch back and forth between a dev environment and an emulator. The only calculator on which I believe it could be easy to work on team projects is the HP 39gII or the HP Prime, as the emulator lets you edit code almost like in Notepad. For the HP 39gII/Prime, program files are saved in a computer folder as you edit them so they can easily be copied online or you can write a script to backup your stuff. TIGCC wasn't too bad due to the test on emu feature, but for most people it didn't even automatically launch the programs.
This is why with Axe and BASIC I always used the calc to code rather than an external editor. Of course I might be forced to switch to TokenIDE when I work on larger 84+CSE games, though, since typing is so slow in the program editor. That said, the problem is not just limited to Axe, though: It just seems that people aren't as dedicated to calc dev as they are for their main hobbies (Minecraft, Call of Duty, League of Legends, computer development, etc), so it's much easier for them to lose interest permanently.
Also in my previous post, I was gonna cite Reuben Quest and Metroid II as other examples, because it took 3 weeks per Reuben Quest games to complete and 2 for Metroid II, but in Reuben's case, almost every battle backgrounds and monsters were ripped from various NES/SNES games, the 2nd game was heavily based on the 1st and for Metroid II, it reused a lot of code from Diortem (although heavy modifications were required since Diortem used Omnicalc instead of xLIB APP). But I guess it can be another example of solo projects that went further (faster) than any team project. Maybe Reuben Quest would never have been completed if it was a team project.
One example of my calc games that suffered from being a team project was Mystique, because the guy vanished 1/3 into development then lost interest when he came back. The worst part is that we saw each others at school IRL (although I didn't have his phone number nor address). He just called in sick almost every day. The rest of the game was finally completed in solo by me, but it suffered in terms of story and it took twice longer to complete than Illusiat 12 (which was much longer). Mana Force 2 had problems as well due to my teamate being too ambitious and wanting to make the game overly difficult, so two dungeons had to be cut from the game. Illusiat 9 was fine, though.
-
The problem, though, is if the project lasts like 3 months or longer, will the head programmer remain interested in calc dev for that long? Many people start calc programming then quickly lose interest for some reason.
This is why I always felt that if a project was going to be a team one, that only one single person should work on the code and that all the sprites should be done as early as possible into development. Else it falls apart easily compared to solo projects. I mean, why has The Reign of Legends 3 only took 6 months to complete as a solo project when all team projects of similar size never came close to being finished? ???
Well, that would certainly be a challenge yes. In this case I'd say again a head programmer would need to be chosen and tasks divided up. Code should be commented in this case in order to keep stuff organized. People should be free to leave if they wish, but if people wish to join they should be able to as well.
In regards to sprites, I would have those done as things develop. The story team and the artists would need to be able to work closely together to see what's needed. Once you have your main plot designed you can do most of the spriting. The head of the programmers also needs to be in communication with the head artist so sprites are done the right size, with the proper amount of colors and the right format etc. That way things are done right the first time and don't have to be redone later(or extra work is at least minimalized).
I'm still not saying it would be easy, but organization and communication are key.
-
Ok, now we all saw the point that we'd need organization on this - is there anybody who thinks he may be suited for this task, or any one of you can think of someone?
I myself have too may projects going on, keep switching between them....
-
I could be this team leader. ;) I already lead a couple school related projects and it went smoothly.
Also with scripting it's easy to test programs in an emulator or on a calc, I can write those scripts. ;) It's basically run the script and it will compile and auto launch the program for you. :) With my personal skills it would be Linux/Mac/<insert your favorite UNIX flavor here> only but an experienced Windows user could port it. This would work for Axe, Grammer, BASIC and Asm. :D And thanks to Shmib's tok8x it'll be on-comp editor and version tracker friendly. I'll work on this stuff over the weekend./me is excited
-
Then let's do this with streetwalker as our leader! Any opponents?
-
I don't contest StreetWalker, but I'm just proposing myself as main coder :) I've already started the battle engine as an isometric 3D tilemapper, I'll just have to continue from where I left (or maybe restart from scratch, since the backup is pretty old). Also Xeda112358, why don't you take care of in-game tilemapping ?
-
Well the goal is.to have a single person leading.the whole project, managing programmers, writers and spriters at the same time. If everyone's ok with it I'll post a more detailed post this weekend. ;)
-
Question: is the latest story revision on the wiki, or on the google doc?
EDIT: the wiki is no more, unless epic7 has a backup of it. I'll ask him about it on FB.
-
I won't mind handling the tilemapper since it is pretty difficult to understand unless you write it yourself (sorry).
Also, I have nothing to contest :)
-
Question: is the latest story revision on the wiki, or on the google doc?
EDIT: the wiki is no more, unless epic7 has a backup of it. I'll ask him about it on FB.
I remember a fair deal of the story, and I think I had a more fleshed out version in the works, somewhere in the depths on my computer.
I'll continue as one of the head writers. (Or, er... I'll take HOMER-16's place) :P
-
Xeda112358 I don't ask you because tilemapping is "difficult", but because you already started it and said that you'll take care of it in the past.
-
I don't think Xeda meant that tilemapping was difficult to do but rather that their code might be a little difficult to dive into if you aren't already familiar with it and how everything works.
-
Oh yeah that's right, sorry ^^'
-
Yeah, I started out with a simple enough method and code, but now it is difficult to decipher.
-
Question: is the latest story revision on the wiki, or on the google doc?
EDIT: the wiki is no more, unless epic7 has a backup of it. I'll ask him about it on FB.
I remember a fair deal of the story, and I think I had a more fleshed out version in the works, somewhere in the depths on my computer.
I'll continue as one of the head writers. (Or, er... I'll take HOMER-16's place) :P
I talked to epic7, and he says he might know where it is. I'll keep you posted there.
Also:
I'll nominate myself as the pimathbrainiac party nominee for head writer (as in, I wish to be one)
-
Also:
I'll nominate myself as the pimathbrainiac party nominee for head writer (as in, I wish to be one)
Some story ideas already exist, just check the wiki as soon as you get it from epic7.
I don't know if i'll contribute much.........well, i could always make a website about it :D
-
Okay so I'm deciding how the team work will be organized since it looks like I'm recognized as lead dev. :)
-All the (re)source, build scripts, etc. will be hosted on Github.
-Shmibs's tok8x will be used to tokenize Axe code which will be stored in raw text files with .axe as extension.
-SPASM will be used for all Asm code (which will e compiled as Axioms) and resource file generation.
-Sprites should be stored as 8x8 or 16x16 BMPs since we use SPASM.
-Code formatting conventions should be established.
-When working on something, contributors would do their thing in a new branch which I'll approve before merging to master.
-I'll write some scripts (GNU make based) to compile Axe code in an emu (tilem2) and then run it either in emu or on an attached hardware calc. This will make testing easy and convenient for everyone.
-Every contributor shall be able to build binaries in order to test (including spriters and mappers). This means that at least a Linux virtual machine is required. I can cook up a VirtualBox image with all the dev environment set up if needed.
Anything to add / ammend ?
-
Meh. Do you want some sprites? I want to improve my skills.
-
I'm not familiar with git, I don't want Virtualbox on my PC and I always program on-calc (by that I mean never think about me programming Axe on a comp). Is it still okay ?
-
I am still not familiar enough with git, either. I was also wondering if we could have a main application that holds a bunch of sub routines so that Axe programs can use the PageSwap axiom to easily access them. The app could also handle loading a save file and copying the main program to RAM and running it (thus protecting the user from RAM clears making them lose the game and having to redownload it to their calc.).
-
The app could also handle loading a save file and copying the main program to RAM and running it (thus protecting the user from RAM clears making them lose the game and having to redownload it to their calc.).
Not sure what you mean by that, could you explain a bit further ?
Using PageSwap to share routines is a good idea though, but then we'll have to build this app before we start anything else.
-
Okay so I'm deciding how the team work will be organized since it looks like I'm recognized as lead dev. :)
-All the (re)source, build scripts, etc. will be hosted on Github.
-Shmibs's tok8x will be used to tokenize Axe code which will be stored in raw text files with .axe as extension.
-SPASM will be used for all Asm code (which will e compiled as Axioms) and resource file generation.
-Sprites should be stored as 8x8 or 16x16 BMPs since we use SPASM.
-Code formatting conventions should be established.
-When working on something, contributors would do their thing in a new branch which I'll approve before merging to master.
-I'll write some scripts (GNU make based) to compile Axe code in an emu (tilem2) and then run it either in emu or on an attached hardware calc. This will make testing easy and convenient for everyone.
-Every contributor shall be able to build binaries in order to test (including spriters and mappers). This means that at least a Linux virtual machine is required. I can cook up a VirtualBox image with all the dev environment set up if needed.
Anything to add / ammend ?
Question: may we do it on googlecode instead? Reason: subversion is portable, git is not :P
Edit: I can make some windows versions of those scripts that will work with wabbit if you want. Shouldn't be too hard
-
The app could also handle loading a save file and copying the main program to RAM and running it (thus protecting the user from RAM clears making them lose the game and having to redownload it to their calc.).
Not sure what you mean by that, could you explain a bit further ?
If the person runs the app OmniRPG, it can be used to load the game, as well as providing a bunch of routines and holding data.
-
I'm confused: How is git not portable? Do you mean in the "port to other architectures" sense (which is not true at all) or the "Not runnable on-calc"? (which is also true of svn)
If you're talking in the "I can have this on a flash drive" sense, then git is still portable.
https://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/list (https://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/list)
-
Non issues:
-git: There's a.Windows app for github for those who don't know how to use it, for pimath: what willrandship said.
-On calc coding: no real problem here but you'll have to detokenize your stuff and merge or overwrite it in git.
Virtualbox is a real problem though. If I can figure out this batch scripting bullshit. then it's not.gonna be necessary but you'll still need tilem and optionallly tilp.
-
Street/Will: yeah, I didn't know that windows app existed
Street: I can make some batch files on windows to do the same thing as your scripts would on linux (using wabbit, though, and not TiLEm.
-
You can run make in cygwin, so as long as we use a cross-platform assembler suite (like the DCS ide does) we should be fine. Just package a cygwin version of make.
Also: Make it use an adjustable setting for the emulator, in a separate config file/section. Then, you can just set up whichever emu you want.
You know, it doesn't really have to open the emulator. Just have it generate a valid program/app/OS and then open it yourself. It makes more sense that way, since you can then send it directly to your calc without rebuilding.
-
The emu is needed to build Axe binaries, but I could of course slave a real calc to build it too, just less convenient. ;)
-
So for example let's say I finished today my battle engine. The source is a *.8xp, and I wrote instructions on how to use it. What do I do with it ?
-
You put the instructions on the Github wiki, and you detokenize your source to a .axe file with the scripts I'll (or Pimath will for Windows) provide then you add it in the project folder and click commit in the Github app. Add a comment, then sync. Boom, you just uploaded your work and everybody can access it. :D
-
How will I put things in the Github wiki ? I know a bit about project management via git (a bit I said), but I never heard of this.
-
Have you ever put something in wikipedia? It's just like that.
-
Nope, but I wrote the AxeDCS doc on dcs.cemetech.net, which I think uses the same web skeleton/functionalities, so I think it'll be okay :P
-
I wish we could do this for multiple platforms so that Prizm and Nspire users could have it too, but that would be too much work, I guess. :P
-
Yep, porting to other languages is difficult, specially with Axe or asm.
-
Actually I think that the github wiki uses the markdown format (which is still pretty simple. ;)
-
Oh now that you say it yeah, files have a *.md extension. I can look at existing files to learn the format :)
-
I wish we could do this for multiple platforms so that Prizm and Nspire users could have it too, but that would be too much work, I guess. :P
I can make a computer port very simply :P