### Author Topic: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010  (Read 51782 times)

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#### Builderboy

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2010, 02:03:05 pm »
Yeah, good sprite art

#### Hot_Dog

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #31 on: January 28, 2010, 12:54:19 pm »
The system for building construction has been changed dramatically. Each building now has a building time. A Scouter starts a building and lets it construct on its own; this means that a Scouter can start construction of another structure as soon as it starts construction of the first one.  (For you Starcraft people, this is like a protoss probe opening up warp gates)  An ACC, however, can only construct one building at a time.

For right now, there is now only one restriction on the ACC, in that it cannot repair buildings when an enemy is near.
There are people who can speak two languages, and they are called bilingual.  There are people who speak three languages and are therefore trilingual.  Then there are people who speak one language, and these people are called Americans.

#### DJ Omnimaga

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #32 on: January 28, 2010, 09:35:03 pm »
Cool, I like the warp gate idea. In Starcraft with Terrans I often ended up not being able to keep up with all these SCVs around when the base grew bigger and eventually some got lost in the mess

#### Hot_Dog

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #33 on: February 02, 2010, 12:16:01 pm »
No new screenshots, because I'm waiting for some better sprite routines from Buckeye.  However, I successfully started implementing objects.  Right now, when moving the tilemap around, pressing 2nd will select a random building and place it at the top right corner of the map position.  I am now currently working on making the building selection user-selectable, which I will probably have a screenshot for since I can use my current sprite routines.

In S.A.D., each player can build up to 5 Operation Centers and up to 45 of any mixture of the other buildings.  Speaking of which, here's some information I put on UnitedTi about defensive structures and balance issues...this is very important:

Quote
In a normal RTS game, defensive buildings can be built next to each other, far away from each other, any positions you desire, and the defense will neither be overpowering nor a waste of money. But if this approach of defensive-buildings next to each other is used in S.A.D. (like it used to be), this causes problems for three reasons:

1. The range of defenses is square, not circular.
2. You can only control one unit. The issue is when defense is stacked together, the amount of damage increases expotentially rather than by a set amount. The thing that's important is that by your enemy being able to control just one unit, two defensive buildings placed next to each other could be a waste of money, but three placed next to each other would be just the right amount, and four placed next to each other would be way too cheap. I can't explain this better without a diagram, but the point is, one unit at a time is not a cost-effective way to take out defense this way.
3. You control your unit manually, and can move/fire in only 8 directions. This means although there are places you could move to avoid being hit by more than one defensive structure (like in a standard RTS game) it can be tedious and, in some cases, impossible.

So the idea is to try to work out defense so that the only way a unit can be hit by multiple defense is by not scouting the area first and, therefore, making a careless move. Then it will be much easier to design defense so that it is not too cheap and not too expensive.

The method used to help with balancing defense (for a cautious player) is preventing defensives buildings from being built so close together.

The first image is a diagram of the area around a typical Point Defense Structure. The range is 3 vertically, horizontally, diagonally, etc. away from the point defense. (Black color wherever possible) The red is each 16x16 area where you cannot put a second Point Defense, because there is some area where a player could be hit by dual fire even with extreme caution. The yellow indicates where Universal Defense cannot be built (but you CAN put standard point defense in that area)...if Universal Defense covers 4 yellow squares (as opposed to 1, 2 or 3 yellow squares), there would be some area where a player would be hit by dual fire even with extreme caution. Any black or white squares means defense can be placed in that area. In addition, Universal Defense can be placed on a 32 x 32 area if it isn't on top of 4 yellow squares. There are some red squares where Universal Defense cannot be built, but I have to work on that

The second image is a diagram of the area around a typical Anti-Air Structure. The concept is the same, but the blue represents where you cannot put a second AA defense.  There are some blue squares where Universal Defense cannot be built, but I have to work on that

With this in mind, AA Defense and Point Defense can be built right next to each other without any issues.

The last diagram is the area around a typical Universal Defense Structure. The range is 4 vertically, horizontally, diagonally, etc. away from the Universal Defense. (Black Color wherever possible). The green represents a 16 x 16 tile where you cannot put Point Defense or AA Defense. The yellow indicates where Universal Defense cannot be built (but you CAN put standard point defense in that area)...if Universal Defense covers 4 yellow squares (as opposed to 1, 2 or 3), there would be some area where a player would be hit by dual fire even with extreme caution. The purple squares are additional Universal Defense no-nos, as well as areas where you cannot put AA Defense or Point Defense.

So if a player is careful, this system prevents overpowering of defense...if defense gives you more than your money's worth, it's the enemy player's fault, not yours.

By the way, this might be the best time to say that the cost of ships and buildings is subject to change when we find out how fast money comes in from refineries. If money comes in quickly, units will be more expensive. If it comes in slowly, units will be cheaper.

This also might be the best time to say that Universal Defense cannot be harmed by a Degruser's Photon Torpedoes.
There are people who can speak two languages, and they are called bilingual.  There are people who speak three languages and are therefore trilingual.  Then there are people who speak one language, and these people are called Americans.

#### DJ Omnimaga

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #34 on: February 02, 2010, 02:34:42 pm »
mhmm nice concept, I think this should help balance the game more.

In Starcraft, there are newer players who will just fill their entire base with cannons. In this case, it can get near impossible to get through if the enemy isn't that great (for example if he forgets that he can just use long-range units)

#### ztrumpet

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #35 on: February 02, 2010, 04:25:56 pm »
Wow, that's cool!  Sounds great!
If I'm wrong, please correct me!
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#### jsj795

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #36 on: February 02, 2010, 09:19:41 pm »
In Starcraft, there are newer players who will just fill their entire base with cannons. In this case, it can get near impossible to get through if the enemy isn't that great (for example if he forgets that he can just use long-range units)
Or mass hydra. Hydralisk is a photo cannon killer
Anyways, nice job, Hot Dog! This really must be a back-breaking hard work!

Spoiler For funny life mathematics:
1. ROMANCE MATHEMATICS
Smart man + smart woman = romance
Smart man + dumb woman = affair
Dumb man + smart woman = marriage
Dumb man + dumb woman = pregnancy
2. OFFICE ARITHMETIC
Smart boss + smart employee = profit
Smart boss + dumb employee = production
Dumb boss + smart employee = promotion
Dumb boss + dumb employee = overtime
3. SHOPPING MATH
A man will pay $2 for a$1 item he needs.
A woman will pay $1 for a$2 item that she doesn't need.
4. GENERAL EQUATIONS & STATISTICS
A woman worries about the future until she gets a husband.
A man never worries about the future until he gets a wife.
A successful man is one who makes more money than his wife can spend.
A successful woman is one who can find such a man.
5. HAPPINESS
To be happy with a man, you must understand him a lot and love him a little.
To be happy with a woman, you must love her a lot and not try to understand her at all.
6. LONGEVITY
Married men live longer than single men do, but married men are a lot more willing to die.
7. PROPENSITY TO CHANGE
A woman marries a man expecting he will change, but he doesn't.
A man marries a woman expecting that she won't change, and she does.
8. DISCUSSION TECHNIQUE
A woman has the last word in any argument.
Anything a man says after that is the beginning of a new argument.

Girls = Time * Money (Girls are a combination of time and money)
Time = Money (Time is money)
Girls = Money squared (So, girls are money squared)
Money = sqrt(Evil) (Money is also the root of all evil)
Girls = sqrt(Evil) squared (So, girls are the root of all evil squared)
Girls = Evil (Thus, girls are evil)
*Girls=Evil credit goes to Compynerd255*

#### DJ Omnimaga

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #37 on: February 02, 2010, 11:30:46 pm »
Well it depends, because if the base only has a tiny entrance and it has about 90 cannons, I wish good luck for the hydras. The only real way to get past that many cannons is using guardians, siege tanks or reavers while keeping a few anti air units behind. Nukes also works but it's not as reliable

#### mapar007

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #38 on: February 03, 2010, 07:40:50 am »
Very nice work. I like how your group project goes on so sweetly 0.0
respect++ for you.

#### Hot_Dog

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #39 on: February 07, 2010, 04:13:19 am »
I have a progress update, but I want to start by answering ztrumpet's question:

Quote
Is it possible to have an option that would show up on calcs with xRam to "Use Ram or xRam"?

We're probably going to have two versions of S.A.D.--one for regular ti-83+, and one for Ti-83+ SE and Ti-84+.  The latter will use the extra ram, as well as 15 MHz mode unless playing against a regular ti-83+.

Now for the update:  In the process of adding objects, I did some work on the icon menu system.  My goal was to create menu code that would make it very, very easy to add the other menus, and it seems to be working so far.  Here's the work I did on adding structures.

In future versions, I'll add hotkey support, and the menu / description text will be displayed over the game, rather than on a blank screen.
There are people who can speak two languages, and they are called bilingual.  There are people who speak three languages and are therefore trilingual.  Then there are people who speak one language, and these people are called Americans.

#### jsj795

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #40 on: February 07, 2010, 08:04:07 am »
Nice! It really looks great, and I love the building graphics as well! Nice job!

Spoiler For funny life mathematics:
1. ROMANCE MATHEMATICS
Smart man + smart woman = romance
Smart man + dumb woman = affair
Dumb man + smart woman = marriage
Dumb man + dumb woman = pregnancy
2. OFFICE ARITHMETIC
Smart boss + smart employee = profit
Smart boss + dumb employee = production
Dumb boss + smart employee = promotion
Dumb boss + dumb employee = overtime
3. SHOPPING MATH
A man will pay $2 for a$1 item he needs.
A woman will pay $1 for a$2 item that she doesn't need.
4. GENERAL EQUATIONS & STATISTICS
A woman worries about the future until she gets a husband.
A man never worries about the future until he gets a wife.
A successful man is one who makes more money than his wife can spend.
A successful woman is one who can find such a man.
5. HAPPINESS
To be happy with a man, you must understand him a lot and love him a little.
To be happy with a woman, you must love her a lot and not try to understand her at all.
6. LONGEVITY
Married men live longer than single men do, but married men are a lot more willing to die.
7. PROPENSITY TO CHANGE
A woman marries a man expecting he will change, but he doesn't.
A man marries a woman expecting that she won't change, and she does.
8. DISCUSSION TECHNIQUE
A woman has the last word in any argument.
Anything a man says after that is the beginning of a new argument.

Girls = Time * Money (Girls are a combination of time and money)
Time = Money (Time is money)
Girls = Money squared (So, girls are money squared)
Money = sqrt(Evil) (Money is also the root of all evil)
Girls = sqrt(Evil) squared (So, girls are the root of all evil squared)
Girls = Evil (Thus, girls are evil)
*Girls=Evil credit goes to Compynerd255*

#### ztrumpet

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #41 on: February 07, 2010, 10:44:52 am »
Excellent!!  I like the building graphics.  You all have done a really nice job with them!

I have a progress update, but I want to start by answering ztrumpet's question:

Quote
Is it possible to have an option that would show up on calcs with xRam to "Use Ram or xRam"?

We're probably going to have two versions of S.A.D.--one for regular ti-83+, and one for Ti-83+ SE and Ti-84+.  The latter will use the extra ram, as well as 15 MHz mode unless playing against a regular ti-83+.
Sounds great.  What will you do about newer 84s that don't have the full xRam?  Are you only using a small portion of it?  If so, then it will work on the new calcs, but you already knew this
Thanks!
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 10:45:13 am by ztrumpet »
If I'm wrong, please correct me!
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#### Hot_Dog

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #42 on: February 07, 2010, 01:30:50 pm »
Quote
What will you do about newer 84s that don't have the full xRam?  Are you only using a small portion of it?  If so, then it will work on the new calcs, but you already knew this

Well, I thought that the newer ones had the same ram structure as the ti-83+ SE.  You're not talking about the n-sprire 84 emulator, are you?  If that's the case, one would probably want to use the 83+ version, which will switch to 15 Mhz if it can.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 01:49:27 pm by Hot_Dog »
There are people who can speak two languages, and they are called bilingual.  There are people who speak three languages and are therefore trilingual.  Then there are people who speak one language, and these people are called Americans.

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #43 on: February 07, 2010, 01:45:40 pm »
Apparently, the NSpire has the extra RAM available, as the Omnicalc RestoreMem() and Virtual Calc functions seem to work correctly. The only problem is that the NSpire is very slow with asm code, so I dunno how you could speed this up.
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#### DJ Omnimaga

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##### Re: [S.A.D.] Progress 2010
« Reply #44 on: February 07, 2010, 03:24:26 pm »
hotkeys will be cool because they really speed things up in SC. Menu icons  looks nice so far btw