Print Page - Dwell - Radical different game idea

Calculator Community => Other Calc-Related Projects and Ideas => TI Z80 => Topic started by: matthias1992 on September 18, 2010, 12:59:26 pm

Title: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on September 18, 2010, 12:59:26 pm

Hey there!

It has been a while since my last post but I am back now! I just recently stumbled across an indie-game called 'The Endless Forest'. Basically this game has no purpose whatsoever, it's kind of hard to explain so check it out for yourself: http://tale-of-tales.com/TheEndlessForest/

So this whole concept of a utopia world with no violence whatsoever but just a very strong ambience drew me. Therefore I will now attempt to make my own implentation of this type of game, since multiplayer is impractical on a calculator platform you will be able to quite some stuff in this game but there likely isn't a certain goal to achieve. Maybe just some easter eggs in the worlds and some other funny/strange things....

I am just thinking about this now and not actually coding it. So, no promises on ever even making it, it's just a idea.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: SirCmpwn on September 18, 2010, 01:32:38 pm

It sounds kind of interesting, I look forward to seeing what you make of it.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on September 18, 2010, 02:10:05 pm

Interesting. It would be nice to see this on calc. We need more variety of stuff for calcs. I think it should add some easter eggs as you suggested, though, maybe some sort of internet/ti community reference.

A while ago, tr1p1ea from MaxCoderz wrote a program called MaxCoderz 5th Anniversary which looks like a RPG but all you can do is travel in a small village talking to NPCs who talks about MC history. http://www.ticalc.org/archives/files/fileinfo/391/39172.html

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: shmibs on September 18, 2010, 03:33:17 pm

mononoke hime anyone?

i was actually planning on making something similar to this(and have been working on it the tiniest of amounts)
it's just a game where the user can explore and try to figure out why things are the way they are. gameplay would switch between overhead 2d(gray and implementing the looping scrolling i've been working out), sidescroller(probably mono), and maybe even some 3d stuff...

this is really cool, though, and i'd like to see what you come up with. maybe you could include optional multiplayer activities using calcnet when it's functional?

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: meishe91 on September 18, 2010, 03:50:50 pm

Sounds like a cool idea :) I wish you luck on the thinking, planning, and programming if you start.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: coolsnake on September 18, 2010, 05:17:31 pm

I've read about this a long time ago, glad to see it's still alive.
It reminds me of a sandbox/openworld game.
Titles like Mabigoni or even Animal Crossing come to mind.
Good luck with that :) It's not easy but I really do love those kind of games.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on September 18, 2010, 05:30:59 pm

thanks for all the encouragements, i already have some ideas... + i used to write stories when I was 2, maybe 3 years older so I might take some elements out of those...

i'll definetely have a hidden lobster somewhere :D

Focus will be on graphics but probaly not grayscale for two reasons, it slows down the game and I ahve 0 experience with it. Altough the second might not be the best reason...

Once again many thanks ya'll!

edit: I think I am gonna first implent this game in my basic engine, skybox, just to get some ideas for puzzles, the overall world, it's secrets, actions etc...then I am going to either use axe or write my own specific library, xlib is athird option it depends on how graphically intesive I'll be making it...

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on September 18, 2010, 11:46:42 pm

No grayscale would be ok. Grayscale is not necessary to make a game look good anyway. Good luck!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Builderboy on September 19, 2010, 03:55:35 am

Indeed, whenever someone says greyscale is the only way to make good looking games, i point to Robot Wars

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on September 19, 2010, 04:39:24 am

What about ROL3/Metroid II? D:
/me runs

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: meishe91 on September 19, 2010, 04:45:46 am

Along with a bunch of other games :P

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Builderboy on September 19, 2010, 04:47:08 am

Lol yeah i know Robot Wars isnt the only game with good graphics out there :P It's just a memorable one that comes to mind

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 17, 2010, 08:16:51 am

Update

Story
You find yourselfs in a destroyed high-tech city. At first you seem to be it's only remaining inhabitant but in your search for food and tools to break out of the city you meet some (awkward) nomads who, like you, dwell amongst the ruins of this destroyed metropol. Most of these nomads have made it their sole purpose to find usefull tools and are willing to trade these for food. Slowly it becomes clwar that there is a secret hidden within this city, a powerful formula of life that will give the owner complete control and understanding over himself and others. It will reveal to you what you will need to do in order to forfill your deepest (un)conscious wish...maybe there is a way out?

Warning
This game contains highly philisophical content, some may like it some may not. Don't think answers will be given straigth up, you'll have to understand the questions before you will understand the answers...

Spoiler For Secrets:

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: ASHBAD_ALVIN on October 17, 2010, 08:24:09 am

sounds cool! good luck with this, it sounds very interesting... :)

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 17, 2010, 02:11:28 pm

Quote from: matthias1992 on October 17, 2010, 08:16:51 am

Spoiler For Secrets:
Dwell has a lot of secrets, most of which are references. A example could be 'Ockhams Razor' which has inscribed on it "I left the inscription out". This refers to the philospohical method called ockham's razor (because it was invented by ockham) that says you have to eliminate everything that isn't strictly necessary for the point you are trying to make. "I left the inscription out" also refers to Rene Magritte's painting of a pipe which has written under it "Ceci n'est pas un pipe" (this is no pipe). With that Rene Magritte showed that his painting wasn't a pipe but a painting of a pipe which is just a copy of the real thing (or if we were to believe plato a copy of a copy making it ever more imperfect).

This gives you a sense of how deep some secrets go, I hop you enjoy finding them and tinkering over them!

Normally, what you do is write awesome spoilers and put a rickroll in the spoiler.

j/k

I like the ideas so far. One thing, though: if you add philosophical stuff, try to not make the game incredibly hard to dechiper either. I mean puzzles that are close to unsolvable and the like, kinda like Donut Quest for the 83+. Else the audience will be rather small.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Builderboy on October 17, 2010, 04:02:40 pm

I really like the concept :D what should we expect in terms of gameplay?

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 17, 2010, 04:09:41 pm

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on October 17, 2010, 02:11:28 pm

Quote from: matthias1992 on October 17, 2010, 08:16:51 am
Spoiler For Secrets:
Dwell has a lot of secrets, most of which are references. A example could be 'Ockhams Razor' which has inscribed on it "I left the inscription out". This refers to the philospohical method called ockham's razor (because it was invented by ockham) that says you have to eliminate everything that isn't strictly necessary for the point you are trying to make. "I left the inscription out" also refers to Rene Magritte's painting of a pipe which has written under it "Ceci n'est pas un pipe" (this is no pipe). With that Rene Magritte showed that his painting wasn't a pipe but a painting of a pipe which is just a copy of the real thing (or if we were to believe plato a copy of a copy making it ever more imperfect).

This gives you a sense of how deep some secrets go, I hop you enjoy finding them and tinkering over them!
Normally, what you do is write awesome spoilers and put a rickroll in the spoiler.

j/k

I like the ideas so far. One thing, though: if you add philosophical stuff, try to not make the game incredibly hard to dechiper either. I mean puzzles that are close to unsolvable and the like, kinda like Donut Quest for the 83+. Else the audience will be rather small.

Don't worry, there wont be many puzzles it is just the things that you find are a little cryptic, not all of them of course (iwas thinking about hiding a Axe somewhere :P)

Quote from: Builderboy on October 17, 2010, 04:02:40 pm

I really like the concept :D what should we expect in terms of gameplay?

Well, most of the gameplay is puzzling and wandering around. I don't think I'll add in any enemies but I return for that you will get rather clever NPC's...i can't say too much about it atm because part of the gameplay is in the ambience and expectation so if I unveil too much it will backfire on the game...

Did I just say, the game?

never mind, I lost.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Builderboy on October 17, 2010, 04:19:31 pm

that sounds excelently amazing :D Cant wait ^^ The world sounds very cool

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: meishe91 on October 17, 2010, 04:39:14 pm

It's sounding really cool :) Good luck!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 18, 2010, 10:11:54 am

So here is a first mockup of the first level, The gate. It was designed using the (wip) tileset that is attached...
it's not a definite design and I left some secrets out :)

Feel free to criticise but keep in mind this is just a test area (an area = 4x3 rooms (a room is 10x8 tiles))

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4085/5093564186_c14230538b_b.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4106/5093579782_f03c507ec7_m.jpg)

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 18, 2010, 03:15:54 pm

O.O

Looks great! Nice map layout. Only thing though, when resizing images use "nearest" as filter instead of "bicubic/linear/default" so the pixels won't become blurry when scaling them up.

How big are character sprites gonna be btw? The buildings doors makes me think something like 4x4

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 18, 2010, 03:28:00 pm

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on October 18, 2010, 03:15:54 pm

O.O

Looks great! Nice map layout. Only thing though, when resizing images use "nearest" as filter instead of "bicubic/linear/default" so the pixels won't become blurry when scaling them up.

How big are character sprites gonna be btw? The buildings doors makes me think something like 4x4

Hmm I made this in a program called 'Tiled' and there are no export options really so sorry for the bluriness but there isn't much I can do about it (plus I like it better when it is slightly blurred)

I didn't really think about the character size I had one at 8x8 but that is indeed to big, Ill rework my doors and make him 6x6.
Glad you liked it!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 18, 2010, 03:30:12 pm

Oh ok. What is the link to the program btw? I remember someone said CalcGS has a tile cap of 216 or something so making large projects with more than 216 tiles was impossible.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 18, 2010, 03:38:57 pm

http://www.mapeditor.org/

edit: this is a general purpose tilemapper, not for the calc! I will eventually write my own software for converting PNGs produced by this program to matrices...yep, I switched to Xlib, if it isn't fast enough or too big I might do it in axe eventually but I am too unexperienced for that atm.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: meishe91 on October 18, 2010, 03:52:57 pm

That is looking really cool! Great job on it :) Can't wait :D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 18, 2010, 06:31:10 pm

Thanks for the encouragements! I'll be working on a tilemap-system with collision detection and masked sprites. If I ahve time I might be able to get some NPC's in there but I'll be happy enough with getting a small demo done at first.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 18, 2010, 07:51:57 pm

Oh the project is xlib now? I thought you went with Axe. Maybe I am consuded with another forum member ;D

I hope you get decent speed. Thanks for the map editor link by the way :)

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Yeong on October 18, 2010, 07:55:18 pm

all right! Another xLib user! ;D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 19, 2010, 11:35:20 am

So I got this problem with masked sprites, it took me the entire knight to fix it. Turns out you have to draw the tilemap and immediately after it the sprites meaning the entire tilemap will be updated every time the player moves around...
maybe I am still overlooking something but this is what I got and it works, if it turns out to be too slow I'll try something else but for now it runs flickerless on 15MHZ mode.

I plan on releasing a small demo today.

edit: I decided to add in enemies. I am just gonna tell that they are there, not where and when... *evil smurk*

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 19, 2010, 02:34:25 pm

Yeah sadly masked sprites require you to update the tilemap every frame. One thing you can do is store the tilemap content in a picture and recall that picture every frame with real(3,picnum,0,0

Demo sounds cool, I'll try to download it later :D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 19, 2010, 02:50:22 pm

Dj, you are a genius. By storing and recalling it as a pic I save alot of processing power which I need if I am to make the NPC's as smart as I intend and do all the checks I need to do, thanks!

I already had a 'DJ' tile but I am now making it the second rarest and toughest to get item in this game, the hardest to get is of course the formula of life which is what the whole story is about...

sorry for the false 'alarm' about the demo, seeing how things are now I'll have to postpone it to (for me) tommorow. You'll see a update here once I have it done :)

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 19, 2010, 03:18:57 pm

You aren't gonna make me look like a lobster in game too? D: j/k

Thanks lol, I remember the first version of Metroid II Evolution updated the map every frame and it was insanely slow. When updating a pic I noticed a considerable increase in speed.

Sorry to hear about the demo being delayed :(

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: shmibs on October 19, 2010, 04:07:07 pm

ooh, progress
xlib should suit this kind of project nicely. your mono graphics look delicious so far(well, except maybe for the player). good luck on a demo!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Geekboy1011 on October 19, 2010, 04:27:31 pm

im am liking the way this is coming along sounds like a game thats right up my alley ^_^ cant wait to try the demo

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on October 19, 2010, 04:34:59 pm

Quote from: shmibs on October 19, 2010, 04:07:07 pm

ooh, progress
xlib should suit this kind of project nicely. your mono graphics look delicious so far(well, except maybe for the player). good luck on a demo!

yes you are right about the player...
he needs something 'extra' maybe a hat? maybe i'll size him back up to 8x8...
once again thanks for all the encouragements, that should keep me working on it! Don't get your hopes up but maybe, just maybe I can get something 'out there' in a couple of hours. It will however be not something worth spending time on tough...

I'll keep you all updated!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: ASHBAD_ALVIN on October 19, 2010, 04:52:31 pm

the tiles and map look nice. Keep up the good work! I always loved these types of games... :D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on October 20, 2010, 01:19:34 am

Quote from: Geekboy1011 on October 19, 2010, 04:27:31 pm

the way chis id coming along sounds like a game thats right up my alley

I am confused by what you mean ???

@Matthias1992 I hope you don't get too busy or something x.x

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on November 11, 2010, 07:38:42 am

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on October 20, 2010, 01:19:34 am

Quote from: Geekboy1011 on October 19, 2010, 04:27:31 pm
the way chis id coming along sounds like a game thats right up my alley
I am confused by what you mean ???

@Matthias1992 I hope you don't get too busy or something x.x

Recently school has been top-priority I had some work to finish, I still have...I will finish this project though, don't worry. I started to get ill today so that's a good excuse to get to the programming!

with 'right up my alley' I think he means that this is the sort of game he enjoys playing (?)

/offtopic:
Sorry for my inactivity in general btw...I still keep an eye around here every now and then but I don't really have the time to post anything or reply...
I am glad to see the site is still as vibrant and alive as ever!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Munchor on November 11, 2010, 09:30:04 am

Nice concept and also like the map, Congratulations and keep working on it! :)

The map looks really cool!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on November 11, 2010, 09:32:46 am

Quote from: matthias1992 on November 11, 2010, 07:38:42 am

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on October 20, 2010, 01:19:34 am
Quote from: Geekboy1011 on October 19, 2010, 04:27:31 pm
the way chis id coming along sounds like a game thats right up my alley
I am confused by what you mean ???

@Matthias1992 I hope you don't get too busy or something x.x
Recently school has been top-priority I had some work to finish, I still have...I will finish this project though, don't worry. I started to get ill today so that's a good excuse to get to the programming!

with 'right up my alley' I think he means that this is the sort of game he enjoys playing (?)

/offtopic:
Sorry for my inactivity in general btw...I still keep an eye around here every now and then but I don't really have the time to post anything or reply...
I am glad to see the site is still as vibrant and alive as ever!

Ah ok thanks for the info. I was a bit confused at that part of his post. I heard it before but couldn't get it.

Also sorry to hear you are busy. I hope you can eventually start coding again regularly and have more time to visit the forums. :(

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on November 15, 2010, 08:20:39 am

no worries, I just have one more week to go with some exams/test and then there will be code! :D

Anyway, I just got some inspiration again. I played bomberk(ids) for the Ti83/84+(SE) today and I loved the 8x8 main chracter sprite so I think I am going to use that sprite in Dwell...I'll credit the original author of course...

edit: 333th post! I am half-way trough getting evil :)

edit2: I might add cinematics but in order to do that I will step back to axe. Main focusses in this game are going to be to make a good AI/NPC and some nice puzzles but hey, some epic in and outtro's are cool to eh?

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on November 15, 2010, 12:04:54 pm

Ah cool to hear. I take it that school exams end around late November in your country?

Also for a cinematic it would be cool, but try to not do the mistake I did in Zelda: Dark Link Quest, and do a 2 minutes long frame-by-frame cinematic sequence that takes like 40 KB of memory. Zelda DLQ ending cinematic sequence is about 30% of the entire game file size alone. ;D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: aeTIos on November 15, 2010, 12:06:54 pm

yes, first exams end end November, the 'big' exam is around june/july

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on November 15, 2010, 12:20:41 pm

Ah cool. :D

In USA, it seems like people get busy around late September until late October, then they get busy again after Christmas vacations, then April-May. In Canada when I went to hi school it was late October-early november (not much exams but lots of projects), march (the large portion of projects+exams) and late May-June.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on November 15, 2010, 02:32:13 pm

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on November 15, 2010, 12:04:54 pm

Ah cool to hear. I take it that school exams end around late November in your country?

Also for a cinematic it would be cool, but try to not do the mistake I did in Zelda: Dark Link Quest, and do a 2 minutes long frame-by-frame cinematic sequence that takes like 40 KB of memory. Zelda DLQ ending cinematic sequence is about 30% of the entire game file size alone. ;D

Yea well, I am going to make the cinematics/cutscenes to be rendered by the actual engine so it won't take up as much size, however this pretty much requires me to make a waypoint-AI and to somehow program in a appvar, events. So it's gonna be tough but I am sure i'll succeed if I get the time to do it...

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on November 15, 2010, 08:15:56 pm

Ah ok, well, try to not hardcode too much of the cutscenes, else you'll reach the code limit fast. X.x

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on December 12, 2010, 04:54:48 pm

Changed my mind, again. Made it a sidescroller. Redesigned tileset, looks more like its LOTR Moria. You start out high in the sky then you get underground where it is very dark and spooky (I hope I can manage to program a flashlight effect) and there are some pretty horrid monsters in there, I try to make it as scary as possible without the use of music...
Next level is the forest, then comes the flatlands and then, hopefully, after all the beating and figthing all the running and hiding you'll be free and you'll go to that place we know is there but no one has ever been...

enough chatter lets give you a small titlescreen! I hope to work on this in the christmas vacation alot...

edit: this game will be reaction based, so you auto walk trough the level but you have to make the right interactions. This will be one of those games with several different endings. A good example is a balancing rope where you have to hit the up button every now and then to prevent falling to your death...the game is mostly inspired on Limbo.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Ashbad on December 12, 2010, 05:29:55 pm

whoa, this is pretty sweet! can't wait for more updates :D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: qazwsx988 on December 13, 2010, 11:40:44 am

Wow, nice work!
Is that grayscale or monochrome?
I love these rail style games.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 13, 2010, 11:13:10 pm

THis looks nice Matthias1992! I assume the title screen will scroll around that area, right? (Since it won't fit in the screen)

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: matthias1992 on February 06, 2011, 06:46:55 pm

My god. I just realized how TERRIBLE i am at keeping you updated...

I intend to go to work on it soon again, but since i reinstalled windows i need to design everything. Considering the story of you being lost in some big place with npcs walking around (thats pretty much the story) what would you consider is the best view? Sidescrolling? Top down? 2/4? Or iso?

Thanks for the feedback!

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: shmibs on February 07, 2011, 04:42:05 am

top down would probably be the easiest, but i REALLY like the airy, in-the-clouds feel of your side view up there, so i say... make it a sidescroller! besides, it's easier to give the player challenges without including enemies if gravity is a factor.

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: Ashbad on February 07, 2011, 09:07:52 am

sidescroller++

That would be awesome with the sprites/tiles you already have :D

Title: Re: Dwell - Radical different game idea
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 08, 2011, 01:49:24 am

Quote from: matthias1992 on February 06, 2011, 06:46:55 pm

My god. I just realized how TERRIBLE i am at keeping you updated...

I intend to go to work on it soon again, but since i reinstalled windows i need to design everything. Considering the story of you being lost in some big place with npcs walking around (thats pretty much the story) what would you consider is the best view? Sidescrolling? Top down? 2/4? Or iso?

Thanks for the feedback!

Wow I'm glad you're still working on this. :) Don't rush yourself, but I'm happy to see this is not dead. I hope by design everything you don't mean you lost the entire project, though. :(

I like side-scrolling, but for such game I think top-down view like an RPG would be better.