Omnimaga

Calculator Community => Other Calc-Related Projects and Ideas => TI Z80 => Topic started by: pimathbrainiac on February 21, 2013, 01:21:09 pm

Title: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 21, 2013, 01:21:09 pm
It's been a year and 3 days since I started this project. I'd like to comment on how far this has come.
I remember thinking about a game idea one day in class. I had my calculator out, even though I was in health class. I was thinking: "simple." I knew at that point that every other project I had started or had thought up but had yet to start was not going to make it for being too complex. I thought of this one game demo I played once. A game titled "VVVVVV." A game that seemed like I could get an engine done in a week (the n00b in me talking at that point) and I could say that I completed a project (I came close with the chess game that brought me here.)

I was allowed to use a laptop in school at that time and said laptop had linking software (I think TiLP), so I made a little screeine and showed the world what I had decided to do. Here was the first screenie:
(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVTEST.gif)

It was a slow, inefficient engine made entirely on-calc. At the time, I thought it was the greatest thing I had ever done. Little did I know that it would eventually be just that.

Here it is now: A game with experimental custom maps, a difficulty that nearly matches the original, and a much better engine.
(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVV_THIS_IS_HARD.gif)

And there's more to come. Bugs are almost out of custom maps, I am re-working the engine to make it faster, and the main map is about 10-15% done. There will also be (not until a few more releases) a new game mode for the totally insane.

At this point, I'd like to acknowledge some people:
Keoni29: For spriting out these amazing sprites.
Matref: For the level editor. I don't know how I could live (or have supported custom maps) without it.
Hayleia: For the optimizations/Helping me realize I need to restructure my code.
And everyone else whose support has made this possible.

To another year of progress and gravity flipping!

Spoiler For original post:
I'm deciding to port VVVVVV to the TI-84! (The Portal clone is currently on standstill, but it SHOULD be back in progress soon!)

For those who don't know what VVVVVV is, check this out: http://thelettervsixtim.es (http://thelettervsixtim.es)

Screenie for the basic engine:

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVTEST.gif)



Going to clear some stuff up for those who will be wondering:

Will this be a full clone?

No, this will be a port in which most levels will NOT be the same as the actual game.

Just need to finish the engine (probably a week), then I will need level designers.

/me pokes everyone who is skilled in AXE spriting

Tilemaps will be 12*8 with 8*8 tiles

LATEST DEMO: http://www.omnimaga.org/ti-z80-calculator-projects/vvvvvv/msg383755/#msg383755

LATEST SCREENIE: http://www.omnimaga.org/ti-z80-calculator-projects/vvvvvv/msg383755/#msg383755
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on February 21, 2013, 02:41:46 pm
Hm, I've actually been working on my own VVVVVV clone, but I've put it on hold for a long time. I'd love to see how yours turns out, though.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 21, 2013, 02:59:28 pm
Hm, I've actually been working on my own VVVVVV clone, but I've put it on hold for a long time. I'd love to see how yours turns out, though.

Any help with the engine you're willing to give? (Assuming you are an AXE programmer)

Specifically: How to make the character die when he touches spikes (see http://ourl.ca/18385)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on February 21, 2013, 03:24:22 pm
I've never worked with AXE before, but I'd imagine that you use pointer-based collision checking rather than what you're doing right now, which is probably pixel testing. Check the tutorials section on the site, this question has been asked an unreasonably large number of times.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 21, 2013, 03:26:01 pm
Pointer based? Doesn't that only work with maps where you move only one tile at a time, though?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on February 21, 2013, 03:27:23 pm
No, it applies to any kind of tilemap. Please check the tutorials.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on February 21, 2013, 03:50:21 pm
This looks pretty slow. This game should be fast paced. I'd love to help you with the sprites and tiles. (I can even convert them to hex by hand if you want me to :P)

Edit: Mockup ;D
Title: Re: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 21, 2013, 04:36:35 pm
Juju also worked on a VVVVVV clone in 2010 but I think he ran into too many bugs and gave up.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Juju on February 21, 2013, 07:35:43 pm
Yeah, I gave the idea to leafy.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: epic7 on February 21, 2013, 07:58:21 pm
This is like the 4th project you've started, so don't make too many more without finishing one first :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 21, 2013, 08:15:35 pm
This is like the 4th project you've started, so don't make too many more without finishing one first :P


3rd... one I stopped the first, and the other is on hold... screenies were slow due to some unoptimized code... new screenies soon!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 22, 2013, 01:51:23 am
This is like the 4th project you've started, so don't make too many more without finishing one first :P

Jup, finish some first :P

But otherwise, it would be cool to have that game on the calculator
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on February 22, 2013, 04:08:59 am
vvvvvv shouldn't be too hard to make. It's kinda like graviter, but you can change the gravity direction at will. See if you can have a look at the source of graviter.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 22, 2013, 08:08:25 am
This is my main project now, Sorunome and epic7. Why? Because I had a marathon run of coding last night and I made the rest of the engine (and maybe introduced a few bugs).

Screenie:

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVENGINE.gif)

Level designers: help me make a bunch of levels linked together (basically an overworld)!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on February 22, 2013, 12:47:39 pm
I'm deciding to port VVVVVV to the TI-84! (The Portal clone is currently on standstill, but it SHOULD be back in progress soon!)

Only to 84+ ? And what Portal clone ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: JustCause on February 22, 2013, 12:53:08 pm
Oooh, yes. This definitely has promise. Monitoring this thread. :3
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 22, 2013, 12:53:51 pm
I'm deciding to port VVVVVV to the TI-84! (The Portal clone is currently on standstill, but it SHOULD be back in progress soon!)

Only to 84+ ? And what Portal clone ?

84 was a general term, and I am making a 3D portal clone, but it's on hold because the library that I am using does not support textures yet...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on February 22, 2013, 12:57:10 pm
You're doing a Portal Clone in 3D with Axe !? O.O Are you sure that it's possible ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 22, 2013, 12:59:55 pm
As I said, it's on hold because the library is not ready yet... see TheMachine02's GLIB for the library I'm talking about.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on February 22, 2013, 01:01:56 pm
Yeah, I was thinking of this one, but still I'm not sure it'll be possible, excepting maybe with a hell-optimized ASM raycaster. I'm pretty sure that polygon- or vertices-based engines can only be too slow for a game like that on handhelds like the z80 ones.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 22, 2013, 11:01:14 pm
UPDATE!

Saving works, and all I need is to make level designs (I've been told crowdsourcing on the level design is bad practice :P)

SCREENIE (showing saves):

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVSAV.gif)

Edit: I'LL NEED BETA TESTERS SOON!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 23, 2013, 12:25:04 am
Looking nice, but does that different looking tile do anything by now?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: _Nicco_ on February 23, 2013, 01:04:26 am
I'll test once I get my calculator.  I'm not sure if the guy has shipped it yet.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 23, 2013, 02:31:45 am
Nice project, but do you plan to use more varied tiles instead of just black, like in a mockup that someone suggested earlier? It would make the game look more attractive.

Also the frame rate seems surpringsly slow considering that there's no scrolling and enemy in the screenshot. Are you refreshing the entire tilemap every frame? Because it's usually better to just refresh the necessary parts of the screen to speed things up.

That said, good luck!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on February 23, 2013, 06:36:54 am
Draw the tilemap to the back buffer and only redraw the front buffer every loop.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 23, 2013, 10:26:28 am
Looking nice, but does that different looking tile do anything by now?

It's a checkpoint... I have the other tiles ready, but I'm just testing overworld creation and saving right now.

I'll test once I get my calculator.  I'm not sure if the guy has shipped it yet.

Thanks! Need to level design first, but that shouldn't take long...

Nice project, but do you plan to use more varied tiles instead of just black, like in a mockup that someone suggested earlier? It would make the game look more attractive.

Also the frame rate seems surpringsly slow considering that there's no scrolling and enemy in the screenshot. Are you refreshing the entire tilemap every frame? Because it's usually better to just refresh the necessary parts of the screen to speed things up.

That said, good luck!

The current tiles are just my testing tiles. I'll redraw all my sprites once I make all the levels. Gameplay before Graphics, in my opinion.

Good idea on the refreshing... I do refresh every loop, and now I won't.
Draw the tilemap to the back buffer and only redraw the front buffer every loop.

I don't know if this will work, but I'll try! :D

Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 23, 2013, 06:34:37 pm
Bump!

This is a source release for the engine. Send VVVVSRC program and the PIMAP appvar to the calc and compile with AXE v 1.2.0 or 1.2.1a (because it uses #ExprOn)

PIMAP and VVVSAV (The save var that is created) MUST be in the RAM due to my currently mediocre skills.

Map design in progress!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 23, 2013, 06:42:49 pm
Cool to hear. As for the map storage I think the best thing is if you could only redraw parts of the back buffer when needed (the area surrounding your character). It would be even faster. Of course that might be harder to implement, though.

And good to hear about the graphics. I was just wondering in case you planned to keep those graphics for the final version :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 24, 2013, 02:21:42 pm
UPDATE!!!

Fast engine, and now I have nothing to do but design levels!

The screenie evidence:

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVFAST.gif)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 24, 2013, 03:55:35 pm
Looking nice, now you need to add spikes :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 24, 2013, 04:03:38 pm
Looking nice, now you need to add spikes :P

already done!

/me points to http://ourl.ca/18384/339239

:P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 25, 2013, 12:47:20 am
The speed is much better now :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 25, 2013, 10:07:03 am
UPDATE!

Here is the first level designed (I ripped it off from VVVVVV because it's my favorite level in the demo version!)

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVDEMOLVL0.gif)

/me must design more today, but he must wait to get home with his HUGE overworld design paper (12 sheets of graph paper linked together, one tile per square)

I'll probably get better graphics out today first, tho. Stay tuned!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on February 25, 2013, 11:59:13 am
Yeaaah, it's really looking great ! But isn't the first level an entire and btw huge world ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 25, 2013, 12:16:07 pm
It's not so much the first level as it is the first string of challenges in the overworld.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 25, 2013, 07:02:54 pm
Looking nice!
I like how you also added the gravity changers
Seems like you at least will finish one project
*Sorunome runs
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: epic7 on February 25, 2013, 09:28:19 pm
I played a little bit of the demo earlier, it looks pretty interesting :3

Looking nice!
I like how you also added the gravity changers
Seems like you at least will finish one project
*Sorunome runs

What was that, Sorunome? :P
/me runs
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Scipi on February 25, 2013, 09:32:18 pm
/me is already getting a little excited. :P

Are all the other areas of the game implemented? Like the vertical scrolling area and the teleporters?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 25, 2013, 09:49:02 pm
Looking nice!
I like how you also added the gravity changers
Seems like you at least will finish one project
*Sorunome runs

What was that, Sorunome? :P
/me runs
Why did you magnify my text :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 25, 2013, 09:52:31 pm
/me is already getting a little excited. :P

Are all the other areas of the game implemented? Like the vertical scrolling area and the teleporters?

Not the vertical scrolling area, definitely (too much of a beast to code), and not the teleporters probably (I am not currently planing on implementing the storyline)

/me has screenies!

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVDEMOLVL1.gif)

/me has a demo! (attached... send both PIMAP and VVVVVV to your calc to run, PIMAP can be archived, if you wish) (VVVVSRC is the AXE source).

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SUPPORT!!!

This project would not have been possible without y'all!!!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on February 26, 2013, 01:59:05 am
This is actually looking quite nice. :) Good job!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: willrandship on February 26, 2013, 09:00:17 am
So, no way of indicating when you've activated a save location? I can see that being more than a little annoying at times.

Here's a GIF of a possible set of On/Off sprites. As a bonus, they're only 7 pixels tall so you should be able to see your character behind them.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 26, 2013, 12:05:43 pm
Looking nice!
I like how you also added the gravity changers
Seems like you at least will finish one project
*Sorunome runs

What was that, Sorunome? :P
/me runs
Why did you magnify my text :P
Because it's true! I will finish this one!!!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 26, 2013, 06:56:30 pm
Looking nice!
I like how you also added the gravity changers
Seems like you at least will finish one project
*Sorunome runs

What was that, Sorunome? :P
/me runs
Why did you magnify my text :P
Because it's true! I will finish this one!!!
That is awesome! *yay*
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 26, 2013, 07:43:05 pm
/me is stopping the quote pyramid right now...

Was that a Fluttershy "yay" or a real "YAY!!!"
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 26, 2013, 07:47:10 pm

/me is stopping the quote pyramid right now...

Was that a Fluttershy "yay" or a real "YAY!!!"
Fluttershy yay of cource :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 26, 2013, 07:50:17 pm
I DID NOT QUOTE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

stoppit, or I will ask for a few of your posts removed... I really don't want spam in here...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on February 26, 2013, 07:54:15 pm
First of all, calm down pimath. Second, he's right guys. Please don't spam up the topic. Thanks. :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 09:21:19 am
New graphics, faster engine, etc. are working... I'll get a screenie out by the end of today!

No new levels yet, sorry...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: willrandship on February 28, 2013, 10:29:05 am
Well, progress is progress! It sounds like a big update to me!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 02:16:58 pm
Here's the graphics update (The engine is faster on-calc than it was before due to a transition from hybrid pointer-based pixel-based to strictly pointer-based, but my computer was lagging badly when I took the screenie)

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVNEWGRAPHICS.gif)

Soooooo..... gotta make more tilemaps for the gigantic tilemap!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ElementCoder on February 28, 2013, 02:26:21 pm
That's another quite big improvement! I like it :D Unfortunately I do not own a TI84 :( therefore you have nspired me to make another 'clone' :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 02:28:31 pm
Wut? First leafy, now ElementCoder? Who else is making/restarting a VVVVVV clone now?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ElementCoder on February 28, 2013, 02:30:43 pm
I fear this is going in the same direction as when Sorunome brought Brainfuck here :P Everyone suddenly started messing around with it with interpreters popping out of the ground by the dozen.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on February 28, 2013, 02:43:22 pm
That's another quite big improvement! I like it :D Unfortunately I do not own a TI84 :( therefore you have nspired me to make another 'clone' :P
Or better: make a 84+ emulator for Nspire :P

Anyway, it is great to see fast progress on this :D
I wonder why you never finished any projects if you code so efficiently O.O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 02:48:37 pm
That's another quite big improvement! I like it :D Unfortunately I do not own a TI84 :( therefore you have nspired me to make another 'clone' :P
Or better: make a 84+ emulator for Nspire :P

Anyway, it is great to see fast progress on this :D
I wonder why you never finished any projects if you code so efficiently O.O

Because I either loose interest or can't do it due to my mediocre skills.



Edit: please don't start another quote pyramid... that goes for anyone!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Phero on February 28, 2013, 02:50:47 pm
Looking very nice!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on February 28, 2013, 04:41:42 pm
I fear this is going in the same direction as when Sorunome brought Brainfuck here :P Everyone suddenly started messing around with it with interpreters popping out of the ground by the dozen.
To be fair, I was working on VVVVVV long before pimathbrainiac started it :P Still, looking great! I'm liking the new sprites.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 06:08:57 pm
True, leafy...

/me still wants to see leafy's screenies
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Builderboy on February 28, 2013, 06:30:35 pm
I fear this is going in the same direction as when Sorunome brought Brainfuck here :P Everyone suddenly started messing around with it with interpreters popping out of the ground by the dozen.
To be fair, I was working on VVVVVV long before pimathbrainiac started it :P Still, looking great! I'm liking the new sprites.
*Coughiscompletelyrewritinghisengineandstartingovercough*
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 06:31:34 pm
Yay IRC for telling us this >:D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on February 28, 2013, 06:32:12 pm
heh :) Anyway, let's get the discussion back to Rampart.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 28, 2013, 07:14:10 pm
I'm also thinking of trying to make this in 68k basic, but I'm not sure if it will work...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 28, 2013, 07:24:19 pm
So, I like the graphics updates! I think you did a great work over there :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 01, 2013, 04:43:29 am
I can't help but mention that the graphics look nothing like the pc version. I understand that the resolution is a bottleneck, but it's no excuse at all to just slap some crude stick figures and blocks on there bearing no resemblance to the original whatsoever. Let me help you with that if you please.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on March 01, 2013, 05:16:22 am
I'm also thinking of trying to make this in 68k basic, but I'm not sure if it will work...

I'm not sure if 68k BASIC would cut it simply because of speed. This game looks fairly action oriented. C or newprog would probably do nicely though. :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 01, 2013, 07:21:42 am
I can't help but mention that the graphics look nothing like the pc version. I understand that the resolution is a bottleneck, but it's no excuse at all to just slap some crude stick figures and blocks on there bearing no resemblance to the original whatsoever. Let me help you with that if you please.

Quite frankly, that was a bit of a mistake to change the graphics from what I had... I can't deal with an 8x16 character sprite, tho (the levels are only going to work with 8x8 right now...

I'm also thinking of trying to make this in 68k basic, but I'm not sure if it will work...

I'm not sure if 68k BASIC would cut it simply because of speed. This game looks fairly action oriented. C or newprog would probably do nicely though. :)

/me doesn't know C or Newprog...

oh well, it was just an idea!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 01, 2013, 10:54:06 am
There you go. 8x8 sprites and tiles. The little outline effects on the blocks adds a huge depth to the graphics. You don't need to use multiple tiles for each type of block. Simply draw lines on the outside of the blocks. You gotta write a little algorithm for this. At the beginning of each room it runs the algorithm and then draws the tiles and the lines to the back buffer. Every step you copy the back buffer to the screen buffer and draw the sprites again. Then you can clear the screen and it loops back trough your code.

Edit: Here are the hex codes for them:
Captain animation:
[3C6A3C183C5A2424] frame 1
[3C6A3C187E3C2424] frame 2

Spikes:
[0000000000245AC9] facing up (there are commands that allow you to flip them around)

Tiles:
[8811224488112244] (You can clearly see this hex code represents a pattern of evenly spaced lines)

Flip gravity lines:
[000000FF00000000] or [00000000FF000000]
Have fun!

EDIT: fixed a mistake I made!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 01, 2013, 05:11:04 pm
Thank you dude!!!

/me can't sprite for his life...

Are these for white-on-black sprites?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 01, 2013, 07:03:28 pm
Invert them to be white on black (or simply NOT the hex string)
Edit: oops forgot the checkpoint. From memory and to hex:
[000018202018005A]
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on March 01, 2013, 09:20:01 pm
Those sprites are looking a lot better IMO, nice job Keoni29!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 02, 2013, 03:38:43 am
Thank you. You might wanna check these hex codes. I converted the sprites by hand.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 03, 2013, 12:06:23 pm
/me won't make much progress this week... just a heads up

Stupid schoolwork...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2013, 02:54:13 pm
Sooooo... My engine was made REALLY slow due to a ton of "OR" statements I added, so no screenies yet D:

However, I have some new levels and Kenoi's graphics implemented, so I will get a screenie in soon (If I can get one in before TI-Concours)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 05, 2013, 03:48:25 pm
Those sprites looks very nice and I think it will definitively fit well in the game. My only worry was that I watched a tool-assisted speedrun of the Commodore style version of the game and the levels seemed ridiculously large! O.O The calc version definitively needs to be toned down lol, because that would be 650 rooms otherwise. :P

http://plixoft.com/images/VVVVVV%20map.png
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2013, 05:39:12 pm
Only doing 100 rooms, so don't worry... The map appvar is ~ 9600 bytes, so it won't get any bigger (it's already accounting for rooms not done yet)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on March 05, 2013, 05:53:04 pm
Sounding good! What are all the OR statements for o_o
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 05, 2013, 06:53:18 pm
Sounding good! What are all the OR statements for o_o
The collision detection of every spike in the room :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2013, 06:54:38 pm
For more checks for more spike blocks... (I need to get some more optimizations in...)

Edit: ninja'd by kenoi!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Builderboy on March 05, 2013, 08:45:02 pm
Wait do you have a single OR statement for every spike?  How exactly are you doing your collision detection?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2013, 09:30:19 pm
Wait do you have a single OR statement for every spike?  How exactly are you doing your collision detection?

I fixed the problem, but to answer your question: pointer based.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Builderboy on March 05, 2013, 09:47:06 pm
Would you mind elaborating a little bit?  Specifically where the large number of OR statements come into play.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2013, 09:53:47 pm
As I said, I fixed it (as in I created a reduced (collision) map based on the full (sprite) map, so I don't need all the or's to check for different sprites that do the same type of collision) I used to use the full map for collision testing as well.

That said: SCREENIE TIME!!! (new graphics part me, part Kenoi)

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVNEWGRAPHICS2.gif)

New levels not in this screenie due to spoiler alerts!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on March 05, 2013, 09:55:28 pm
Those graphics are awesome!
Maybe you could make the current checkpoint be somehow highlighted?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Builderboy on March 05, 2013, 09:55:42 pm
Ahh good to hear, and looking good as well!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on March 05, 2013, 10:09:21 pm
Nice! glad to hear you solved your collision inefficiencies, and the graphics are shaping up quite nicely as well.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 06, 2013, 03:29:43 am
Looks nice and nice speed so far. Do you plan to make the background black like the original (and add borders around floor/wall tiles like in Keoni's screenshot?)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 06, 2013, 09:37:35 am
Looks nice and nice speed so far. Do you plan to make the background black like the original (and add borders around floor/wall tiles like in Keoni's screenshot?)

I do not plan on a black background because I like the graphics I have right now... I might later, though.

I'm working on the logic for the lines right now, but I probably won't need them due to the almost solid borders of the floor tiles.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 06, 2013, 09:45:40 am
When you have the black background the borders aren't clearly visible. It won't be that hard to make the line drawing algoritm. Make sure to use Rect( instead of Line(
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 06, 2013, 09:51:17 am
As I said, I'm probably not doing a black background... I'll work on that line routine though...

Thanks for the sprites!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 06, 2013, 03:52:57 pm
Ah ok. Will you still add an outline or something around walls? It might make the graphics look less repetitive in overall and less generic (like most old calc games).

EDIT: Here's what I mean below:
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 06, 2013, 05:02:24 pm
I'll work on the algorithm, but no promises...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 07, 2013, 02:43:24 pm
Actually, for the example above, I tried without the inside corners and it doesn't necessarily look bad, so you could just not use them and you would need even fewer tiles (I think about 15 fewer tiles)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 07, 2013, 02:48:33 pm
Actually, for the example above, I tried without the inside corners and it doesn't necessarily look bad, so you could just not use them and you would need even fewer tiles (I think about 15 fewer tiles)

I don't get where you're going...

But if it is about size/speed:

That won't make a difference in the size/speed of the map/game because the map is a set # of bytes... 0 still is a tile, just a blank one...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 07, 2013, 02:56:33 pm
I was talking about the tile data. There's no way your entire sprite data takes 0 bytes of space.

For example, in the following tileset:

(http://www.omnimaga.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=15787.0;attach=14802;image)

There is 160 bytes worth of data, rather than 8 if you use no border. If you add inside borders too, you end up with 280 bytes of sprite data I think.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 07, 2013, 02:59:02 pm
I meant that the byte WAS 0, not 0 bytes...

I misunderstood your point... I think I'll use a line-drawing command instead of making a bunch of different sprites, though...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 07, 2013, 03:01:52 pm
First of all, stop being rude to people who try to help by giving suggestions. Secondly, you have even less reasons to be rude if you do no effort on reading people's post prior responding to them. I have downrated all of your rude posts. From now on I am boycotting all your projects until you change your attitude. Be careful because it's easy to get banned from Omni for being unnecessarily rude.

Don't wonder why at one point nobody will reply to any of your projects anymore: People will just be too scared of doing it, fearing you'll snap at them for idiotic reasons.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 07, 2013, 03:06:47 pm
Dude, I'm sorry and I wasn't trying to be rude!

I misunderstood your comments and you misunderstood mine! That's all...

And I think your plan is great (I actually thought about it beforehand), but I thought using a line-drawing routine would be faster and smaller than using a different sprite for every possible outline drawing.

/me needs to work on his people skills

please forgive me!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on March 07, 2013, 03:24:46 pm
It is not really hard to make an outline routine using several sprites. I have one just below (where 0 is nothing and 1 is wall) :)
On the contrary, I have no idea how to do it without sprites ???

So, here is for example a rendering of a map with only 0s and 1s, first without borders, then with borders
Spoiler For Spoiler:

.AA
. . .
 8
2 4
 1
. . .
[]->°Sprites
[0000000000000000]
[FF81B9B5AD9D81FF]
[FF81B9B5AD9DB9B5]
[FF01B975EDDD01FF]
[FF01B975EDDDB975]
[FF80BBB7AE9D80FF]
[FF80BBB7AE9DBBB7]
[FF00BB77EEDD00FF]
[FF00BB77EEDDBB77]
[AD9DB9B5AD9D81FF]
[AD9DB9B5AD9DB9B5]
[EDDDB975EDDD01FF]
[EDDDB975EDDDB975]
[AE9DBBB7AE9D80FF]
[AE9DBBB7AE9DBBB7]
[EEDDBB77EEDD00FF]
[EEDDBB77EEDDBB77]

.create a random map in L1 with only 0s and 1s
~1->r1
For(96)
 rand^2->{r1+++L1}
End

Draw()
Fill(L5,128,0)
Copy(L1,L5,96)
For(X,0,11)
 For(Y,0,7)
  If {Y*12+X+L5}
   {Y-1*12+X+L5}*2+{Y*12+X+1+L5}*2+{Y*12+X-1+L5}*2+{Y+1*12+X+L5}+1->{Y*12+X+L1}
  End
 End
End

Lbl Draw
ClrDraw
0->X
For(12)
 ~1->Y
 For(8
)
  Pt-On(X*8,Y++*8,{Y*12+X+L1}*8+°Sprites)
 End
 X++
End
DispGraph
Pause 3600
ClrHome
Return

edit of course it can be optimized, but I made that like that so I didn't optimize at all :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 07, 2013, 10:46:45 pm
The rudeness was more in the use of caps and unnecessary exclamation marks (which are often used for yelling) which seemed like you were being unnecessarily annoyed at my comments, even though I was just giving suggestions. As for the outline before I left I forgot about Hayleia's technique and thought about it. It would definitively be nice since map data might be smaller that way. Maps could take a while to render if not optimized, though. You could try with Hayleia's technique or ask Shmibs if he still got his program that did the same thing. It's similar to what Illusiat 12, Mana Force 2, ROL1 and ROL2 use, except more advanced (in my games, only the bottom tile could be different)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: shmibs on March 08, 2013, 02:21:23 am
a routine like that wouldn't really be necessary when you have so few tiles to keep track of, unless you start using nibble values for things rather than full bytes, and you do run the risk of slowing things down (although it can be done quickly enough to be imperceptible if you only draw the map on the first frame and just store/recall from the back buffer). one thing that you could do to ease the whole process would be to make yourself a map editor that lets you place walls all as one tile and then uses this method to convert them dynamically to the values you'd need for the separate sprites that dj made.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 08, 2013, 02:52:34 am
It would be nice at least if he made himself some sort of map editor/converter that can generate such map, though, so that it's much easier for him to create the actual maps.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 08, 2013, 03:37:58 am
It is not really hard to make an outline routine using several sprites. I have one just below (where 0 is nothing and 1 is wall) :)
On the contrary, I have no idea how to do it without sprites ???

So, here is for example a rendering of a map with only 0s and 1s, first without borders, then with borders
Spoiler For Spoiler:

.AA
. . .
 8
2 4
 1
. . .
[]->°Sprites
[0000000000000000]
[FF81B9B5AD9D81FF]
[FF81B9B5AD9DB9B5]
[FF01B975EDDD01FF]
[FF01B975EDDDB975]
[FF80BBB7AE9D80FF]
[FF80BBB7AE9DBBB7]
[FF00BB77EEDD00FF]
[FF00BB77EEDDBB77]
[AD9DB9B5AD9D81FF]
[AD9DB9B5AD9DB9B5]
[EDDDB975EDDD01FF]
[EDDDB975EDDDB975]
[AE9DBBB7AE9D80FF]
[AE9DBBB7AE9DBBB7]
[EEDDBB77EEDD00FF]
[EEDDBB77EEDDBB77]

.create a random map in L1 with only 0s and 1s
~1->r1
For(96)
 rand^2->{r1+++L1}
End

Draw()
Fill(L5,128,0)
Copy(L1,L5,96)
For(X,0,11)
 For(Y,0,7)
  If {Y*12+X+L5}
   {Y-1*12+X+L5}*2+{Y*12+X+1+L5}*2+{Y*12+X-1+L5}*2+{Y+1*12+X+L5}+1->{Y*12+X+L1}
  End
 End
End

Lbl Draw
ClrDraw
0->X
For(12)
 ~1->Y
 For(8
)
  Pt-On(X*8,Y++*8,{Y*12+X+L1}*8+°Sprites)
 End
 X++
End
DispGraph
Pause 3600
ClrHome
Return

edit of course it can be optimized, but I made that like that so I didn't optimize at all :P
wow! Looking amazing! You will just have to run this at the start of a room and copy the buffer you wrote it to to the screen.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on March 08, 2013, 04:52:41 am
wow! Looking amazing! You will just have to run this at the start of a room and copy the buffer you wrote it to to the screen.
Thanks :)
But, yeah, either run it just before a room in the main program, or as Shmibs said run it in the program editor ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 08, 2013, 10:02:25 am
I think I have a solution!

In my map-creating program could do the sorting stuffs for me and I could use separate sprites!

I was trying to think of a way to use separate sprites without having to redo my maps and keep track of more tile types, and I think I got it!

In the prog that makes the map appvar (the prog is actually a HUGE app with all the data), I can make a routine that converts the stuffs to the different types of sprites needed (16 different combinations of outlines, if my calculation is right) and not slow down my main program with an algorithm. (I'm going to borrow some of Hayleia's code for this).

On a side note: I'm sorry for using the caps and stuff... I use caps as a stressor instead of italics... I don't mean yelling unless the entire sentence is in all caps.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 11, 2013, 10:33:23 am
So... line drawing's done! I didn't do it Hayleia's way or Shimbs's way (I couldn't think of a way to implement them in my current source), but I did it with the line( command (and it is pretty good, if I may say so myself ;D)

Thanks for the support!

On a side note, I might use full (only when drawing the map) to keep things smooth when transitioning (not implemented yet)

And now: *Drumroll*

SCREENIE!!!

(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/VVVVVVLINEGRAPHICS.gif)

Downloads for PIMAP, VVVVVVSRC, and VVVVVV are attached
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 11, 2013, 11:03:00 am
That stack of spikes still looks weird. Can't you have a special tile for that?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 11, 2013, 11:36:28 am
Looks much better so far :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 11, 2013, 12:02:12 pm
That stack of spikes still looks weird. Can't you have a special tile for that?

Since you are a spriting genious, do you think you can do an omni-directional spike in the same style as the current single-direction spikes?

I'll try, but they probably will suck...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 11, 2013, 12:43:05 pm
Can you convert them yourself?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 11, 2013, 12:55:46 pm
yeah, I can convert them!

Thanks!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 20, 2013, 01:10:33 pm
Have you put these tiles in your game yet?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 20, 2013, 01:12:34 pm
Been too busy the past week (TI-Concours). I will soon, though.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on March 20, 2013, 02:39:00 pm
Those tiles looks cool by the way :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on March 20, 2013, 03:09:52 pm
Thank you. Out of all the 2^64 possibilities I have picked these 3.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 20, 2013, 03:23:57 pm
I really like those tiles, and I think I'll implement them today!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on April 12, 2013, 03:23:27 pm
Just a heads up: I'm about half way done with the overall map, so I'll be releasing a new edition soon!

Also, I [gulp] might [/gulp] be implementing a grayscale background to make stuffs more interesting to look at (assuming I know what I'm doing with the buffers).
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on April 12, 2013, 03:26:19 pm
Great :D
And adding a grayscale background is really easy, if it never moves. All you need to do is to add your hex code somewhere, stored at a pointer called °BG for example (really original :P) then you replace all your "DispGraph" by "DispGraph(L6,°BG)" :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on April 12, 2013, 03:30:08 pm
It would be that easy except I use the back buffer for map segment storage so I don't have to redraw the map segment every frame.

I think I can fix that with a few copy statements and a third buffer, though, so I will be using that method (and your interrupt grayscale method) for that!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on April 12, 2013, 03:36:31 pm
???
The method I gave you doesn't involve the back buffer ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on April 12, 2013, 03:38:55 pm
I thought all grayscale required the back buffer?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on April 12, 2013, 03:43:23 pm
Nope. Grayscale requires two buffers, but the second one is not necessarily the back buffer L3 (and the first one is not necessarily the main one L6).
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: willrandship on April 12, 2013, 05:23:31 pm
You can now represent any buffer as the back-buffer in a draw command, since version 1.0.something IIRC. So, any 768-byte buffer will do. Dispgraph(BUF1,BUF2)r for example, for 3 level grey. So, Dispgraph(L6,NEWBUF) would do it.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on April 12, 2013, 06:47:50 pm
Oh wow that is awesome. I didn't realize we could now do that in Axe. I didn't mind using L3/L6 for display before, but being able to use something else for the game would definitively have been nice.


Also good to see this is still updated :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on April 12, 2013, 07:01:56 pm
Wouldnt greyscale slow it down too much?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: willrandship on April 12, 2013, 10:02:50 pm
Only if he doesn't already need to delay it a lot.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on April 25, 2013, 12:43:55 pm
Still working on this game?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on April 25, 2013, 12:46:31 pm
Yeah. Haven't had time to make much progress lately, though :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on April 25, 2013, 03:15:23 pm
Still hoping it goes further at some point (as in, doesn't die and that it actually gets finished) :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on April 25, 2013, 09:12:56 pm
Yeah, please don't let this awesome project die!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 31, 2013, 01:52:55 pm
Well, I'm here to tell you some bad news, but also some good news.

Bad news: I lost all my source D:

Good news: all the source except for the actual tilemap source is online, just a bit out of date. I'm picking this back up for the summer! Stay tuned!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: epic7 on May 31, 2013, 08:53:57 pm
I thought you would have learned your lesson from Axe Chess :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 31, 2013, 09:17:14 pm
I did, but it was an accidental deletion on the computer (where the only files were at that moment) and a blind "empty recycle bin"
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 31, 2013, 09:37:55 pm
Uh, that sucks >.<
Just do it like me: never delete a file (and never empty the recycle bin ^^)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 31, 2013, 09:38:25 pm
butbutbut space = precious on old systems.
Title: Re: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Scipi on May 31, 2013, 10:00:38 pm
I keep around a 2TB portable harddrive for these things.

Also dropbox :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 31, 2013, 10:04:54 pm
I got a 1TB one just after this thingy happened (before I got my new computer).

(Also: my new computer's down arrow is weird)
(Also Also: NEW LEVEL!!!!!)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: leafy on June 01, 2013, 03:15:35 am
Yeah, I highly recommend getting Dropbox, so you can share your files across all computers as well as recover deleted files.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on June 01, 2013, 07:32:30 am
Yep. I got about 26GB of dropbox space for free because our university participated in the great space race :) I use db a lot.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on June 01, 2013, 11:10:21 am
I have a dropbox... but I use it for file sharing, not for storing all my files (I only have 2 GB)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on June 01, 2013, 11:20:00 am
Calc files are kB. Not GB
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on June 01, 2013, 11:28:48 am
Calc files are kB. Not GB
^This. The 84+CSE is the z80 with the biggest memory and it has 3.5 MB available so really, your files are a lot smaller than the GB limit you are talking about. Not even one of your program will reach 1MB. They'll all have a size of the order of the KB.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on June 01, 2013, 11:30:16 am
I got all of my calc files backed up on my pc and I never throw away any backups. Yay for 1TB hdd. Never worry about file size!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on June 01, 2013, 12:14:55 pm
I think the only time I threw away backups was when I switched computers in 2005 then left my old 2002-04 calc files including the defunct ROL4 project there, then eventually deleted everything on that hard drive. The only other copy was on Earthforge, which died a year later. I kinda regreted it later, even though the project was dead, because it could have been useful to show people how the game looked like or to start new projects. The other time I lost backups was when I had to use floppy disks because flash drives still costed $300 for a 128 MB stick. For some reasons, the entire content on the floppy disk containing some unreleased 2002 games vanished entirely.

Anyway it's best when you do calc programming to create a copy of the game everyday, then every two or three day send another copy on your computer or another calc. An online copy is a big plus too, in case some natural disaster occurs or something.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on June 01, 2013, 12:42:07 pm
Kept those floppies too close to your magnet collection, dj? ::)

I have had multiple cases of mass data loss. Not because it's not on my computer anymore, but because I have no idea where I put it. Some of my calc programs are still floating around somewhere.
Pro-tip: Store all of your small, but important files such as code (all code for any language) projects, and calc programs on dropbox or any other cloud service.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on June 01, 2013, 05:11:36 pm
I'm working on recreating the tilemap. I had a backup of it, actually, but on graph paper, not on the computer.

Well, I guess this is lesson learned!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on June 10, 2013, 11:23:25 pm
Kept those floppies too close to your magnet collection, dj? ::)

I have had multiple cases of mass data loss. Not because it's not on my computer anymore, but because I have no idea where I put it. Some of my calc programs are still floating around somewhere.
Pro-tip: Store all of your small, but important files such as code (all code for any language) projects, and calc programs on dropbox or any other cloud service.
Most likely, but I don't recall having placed my magnets in the same place as my floppy disks. Also only 1 floppy disk was affected (that one). I noticed a few years later that one of my ZIP disk was affected too, though.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on July 01, 2013, 06:48:37 am
Now is the time to back up all of those floppies. I have a lot of blank diskettes here, but I only use one for transferring files from my pc to my dos computer.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on July 03, 2013, 09:46:04 pm
I wouldn't be surprised if everything I had there was backed up on my computer or DVDs. The only thing I doubt that is is the Reign of Legends v0.70 build that was never publicly released, but we wouldn't lose much anyway, unless somehow people wanted to buy it as super ultimate mega rare collector item on Ebay for $499.99 :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 01, 2013, 06:15:58 pm
HOLY NECROPOST BATMAN UPDATE OF DEATH!!!!!!!!!

So, after all that trouble, I decided to restart the maps from scratch and change a few lines of my code to work with the more traditional tilemap format that I'm using. These are not the same maps as before, and you MUST replace all files, delete PIMAP.8xv and delete VVVSAV.8xv from your calculator before you play.

Without further ado: the screenies:

(http://img.ourl.ca//VVVVVVISBACK.gif)

I plan on implementing Keoni's sprites later, but for now, these are the sprites being used. Also: as you see, not all of the map has been redone. I'm going to change the maps from this point forward from the old ones.

Planned features/levels (in no particular order):

A menu
Multiple saves (maybe)
Shiny trinkets
Veni Vidi Vici
Some non-linear gameplay, but no overworld (sorry).
And most importantly: Custom Maps!

(I also have an idea for a multiplayer gameplay mechanic, but I'll need some time before I can guarantee that this may indeed happen)

Zip attached! Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 01, 2013, 06:28:58 pm
Yaaaaaaaay! I am so glad this is not a dead project.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 01, 2013, 06:30:51 pm
Yay, this isn't dead, it is looking awesome so far :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 01, 2013, 06:31:19 pm
Keoni/Soru: I'm glad I didn't let it die.

Also: Those sprites might take me two updates to add to the game. It depends on how I feel (lazy, or not lazy) when I am working on the next few updates.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: JWinslow23 on December 01, 2013, 06:44:22 pm
+1
I was actually thinking the other day when I was playing the original,
"I wish there was a version of this for calculators."

Although you didn't implement everything from the game (I bet I could add some stuff, though ;-) ), this is my wish come true.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 01, 2013, 06:47:25 pm
Hey, it's a work in progress. What can I say ;)

That said: I really don't plan on making this a direct clone of the original. It's probably possible, but also probably out of my reach.

EDIT: I also prefer taking concepts and ideas and expanding on them then just putting them in different words (or in this case, platforms)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on December 01, 2013, 07:51:03 pm
Pretty cool seeing this picked up again. I was just thinking about it the other day too. :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on December 02, 2013, 12:29:37 pm
Hey, you got some nice progress here ! :D/me gives Pimath a cookie
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: JWinslow23 on December 02, 2013, 12:40:02 pm
/me gives Pimath a cookie
/me copies Streetwalker
(http://osl.cemetech.net/images/upload/9.png)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Eiyeron on December 02, 2013, 03:09:05 pm
HEy! THat's my cookie, let me clone it before you can use it!/me takes back his cookie, clone it x^x^x times and gives it back.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 02, 2013, 06:51:50 pm
*Whelp* I need to work on the menu now, but I seriously don't know how...
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 03, 2013, 02:10:09 am
Press start to start
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on December 03, 2013, 02:13:48 am
What's the problem with the menu ? If you know how to move a character on the screen, you know how to move an arrow on the screen that would indicate the current choice ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TheMachine02 on December 03, 2013, 03:00:24 am
who just see this and I can said that this is pretty good work  :P 
/me expects more

/me run
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 03, 2013, 01:46:21 pm
What's the problem with the menu ? If you know how to move a character on the screen, you know how to move an arrow on the screen that would indicate the current choice ;)

I just haven't done a fancy one before

That said, I have one in the making, and I should have it done by tomorrow.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 03, 2013, 04:06:24 pm
Bump Update!

(http://img.ourl.ca//VVVVVVMENU.gif)

It has a menu now! :w00t:

As you see, there will be more options in the menu later, as there are slots for them to fit later.

Zip attached, enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 03, 2013, 04:09:52 pm
yay, nice and basic menu :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on December 04, 2013, 11:13:02 am
That's one nice looking menu. It'd be even better if you used a different font though. ;)/me looks like he doesn't like to see the OS small font next to fancy graphics. :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TheMachine02 on December 04, 2013, 12:23:54 pm
it's look pretty awesome   :D  one thing though : did you plan to change the way it's disp "Create sav..." (the big font) ? cause it don't look very good with such epic thing  :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 04, 2013, 12:37:37 pm
TheMachine: Yeah, I'm working on that.

I made a few slight changes to the menu based on Kenoi's suggestions on IRC, and some other stuff that I think will look better.

Also: there are a few bugs that I noticed when I was playing having to deal with some problems with the map.

New update tonight!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TheMachine02 on December 04, 2013, 12:52:36 pm
TheMachine: Yeah, I'm working on that.
[...]
New update tonight!

 :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ZippyDee on December 04, 2013, 02:30:26 pm
Just a point I feel I should make after watching that screenie, one thing that VVVVVV makes a point to do very well is to never place spikes in a location that immediately kills you without warning when changing screens. There should never be a place where the spikes go all the way to the edge of the screen where you can enter from the other side. There should be at least a 1 tile gap so it doesn't feel like the game is cheating you.

Other than that this game honestly looks fantastic!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 04, 2013, 03:12:06 pm
Wait until the new sprites are used :3
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 04, 2013, 04:58:54 pm
Just a point I feel I should make after watching that screenie, one thing that VVVVVV makes a point to do very well is to never place spikes in a location that immediately kills you without warning when changing screens. There should never be a place where the spikes go all the way to the edge of the screen where you can enter from the other side. There should be at least a 1 tile gap so it doesn't feel like the game is cheating you.

Other than that this game honestly looks fantastic!

Yeah, that's one of the problems with the map atm.

And then there are Kenoi's sprites, which, assuming I'm not lazy, will be added to tonight's update.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 04, 2013, 06:38:50 pm
UPDATE! As promised!

Screenie:

(http://img.ourl.ca//VVVVVV_New_Sprites_And_Updated_Menu.gif)

Like the sprites, Kenoi?

Anyways: Zip attached as always! Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ZippyDee on December 05, 2013, 12:37:25 am
That looks great! I think you should leave the sprites that are visibly adjacent to a wall as your originals and use the freestanding spikes as Keoni's. Also I noticed that you changed the location of that gap so it didn't have the spike issue. looks awesome!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 05, 2013, 02:17:33 am
Yeah that is exactely what I made this tileset for: to replace the freestanding spikes. It looks nicer to have regular spikes on walls.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TheMachine02 on December 05, 2013, 03:21:04 am
yay ! /me downloads and starts playing
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 05, 2013, 07:58:34 am
That looks great! I think you should leave the sprites that are visibly adjacent to a wall as your originals and use the freestanding spikes as Keoni's. Also I noticed that you changed the location of that gap so it didn't have the spike issue. looks awesome!

Okay! I'll work on that for tonight's update!

Thank you all for the feedback and the support!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 05, 2013, 10:42:21 am
Yay, idea for the menu: maybe make the text move rather than the selection box, that would add a bit ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TheMachine02 on December 05, 2013, 11:27:33 am
idea too for the "saving/creating" thing : maybe make a total random map based out of the bordur spirits with text in inverted mode /small font

EDIT :300 posts ^^

Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 05, 2013, 07:28:35 pm
Just a small sprite update tonight, adding back in the old stand alone sprites!

(http://img.ourl.ca//VVVVVV_Small_Sprite_Update.gif)

Zip attached! Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 06, 2013, 09:21:23 am
Looks much nicer now!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 06, 2013, 10:00:30 am
You are getting better at that level :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on December 06, 2013, 11:46:34 am
I'm looking forward to the calc. version. I bought VVVVVV for my 3DS yesterday and I've been addicted to it. I wasn't sure that it would be very engaging at first... boy, was I wrong. :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 06, 2013, 06:58:02 pm
Moar update!

This time, I added a new level!

(http://img.ourl.ca//VVVVVV_New_Level_1.gif)

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 06, 2013, 06:59:27 pm
looking awesome :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 06, 2013, 07:00:17 pm
Hey I know that part from the original game. The noob trap.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 06, 2013, 07:01:44 pm
Yeah, That was in the old levels with the older engine. Now it's time for me to get creative with new levels.

EDIT: In true nerd fashion, I emailed Terry Cavanagh, the creator of the original game, informing him of the port.

/me wants to know what he thinks.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 06, 2013, 07:26:59 pm
Glad this was revived. :D I was sad when juju stopped working on his version in 2011 and when yours went dormant. D:

Hopefully the author doesn't send you a cease and desist letter to you like Camelot did to Tenniskid for Golden Sun 83+ in 2005. <_<
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 06, 2013, 07:28:41 pm
Glad this was revived. :D I was sad when juju stopped working on his version in 2011 and when yours went dormant. D:

Hopefully the author doesn't send you a cease and desist letter to you like Camelot did to Tenniskid for Golden Sun 83+ in 2005. <_<

I sure hope not! I need some sort of response from the original author before I continue any further, though. It would be awesome to have Terry Cavanagh's support!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 07, 2013, 04:51:45 am
Please no cease and desist letter, please not D:

Maybe we could all beg him if he tries :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 07, 2013, 04:54:35 am
Most of the time indie devs are cool with stuff like this. I asked the creator of HeroCore if it was ok to port his game to the calc and it was fine.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 07, 2013, 07:34:58 am
That's true, remember how Vlambeer was amazed when he learnt about my Super Crate Box port :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: willrandship on December 08, 2013, 04:24:18 pm
Terry Cavanagh would be fine with it. People make remakes of his games for the C64 all the time.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 08, 2013, 04:26:01 pm
So I haven't had much inspiration for a new level chunk to add. I want to do Veni Vidi Vici, but much later.

Any ideas?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Eiyeron on December 09, 2013, 06:35:26 am
Terry Cavanagh would be fine with it. People make remakes of his games for the C64 all the time.

Terry likes to see his games ported! Go for it!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 09, 2013, 02:20:06 pm
So I got this in reply to my email:

Quote
This is looking really awesome! Good luck with it :)

/me is excited!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 09, 2013, 02:49:37 pm
yaaaay, progress go go go :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on December 09, 2013, 05:32:41 pm
That's great Pimath! :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 11, 2013, 05:16:56 pm
So I haven't made much progress recently with school and all, but I'll get y'all an update by Christmas.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 12, 2013, 02:54:51 pm
bump.

Well, There was a bug where right-facing spikes wouldn't kill you. This was due to a mis-typed number in the code. It's fixed in the attached zip.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 16, 2013, 02:46:56 pm
bump again!

Small map update. I changed the most recent level a bit to make it more challenging!

(http://img.ourl.ca/MORE_TO_COME.gif)

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 16, 2013, 04:18:15 pm
Not challenging enough!
JK, lol, that looks hard :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 16, 2013, 04:32:32 pm
It appears as if the hitbox is a bit to large which is really annoying :(
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 16, 2013, 04:34:34 pm
That's a problem in the rendering, I think. It calculates weather you've been hit or not, then it renders the frame. If I change the order, it should be better with the spikes, I think. Maybe. I'll try later, but I'm too lazy at the moment :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on December 16, 2013, 09:51:45 pm
Would it be possible to do a version of Pushing Onwards in this for those with the Orion?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 16, 2013, 11:03:22 pm
I'm pretty sure it would, but I don't know how you can interface with Orion from Axe Parser. Maybe some inline assembly would be required.

Btw this looks nice Pimath. However, it seems the collision with spikes is way too sensitive. It seems incredibly hard to go through narrow paths without hitting them and even when not touching them you still die sometimes.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on December 17, 2013, 03:15:54 am
The orion is very expensive though. If you're going for an external sound device you might want to find something a bit cheaper.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 17, 2013, 12:20:39 pm
/me can't even do that because he doesn't have an orion or have a 2.5mm jack converter (b/c parents, go figure *shrugs*)...

@DJ: yeah, I'm working on it
Title: Re: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 17, 2013, 12:30:21 pm
Yeah, since the Orion is about $600, I doubt that many people would use it for a calc game.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 17, 2013, 06:38:45 pm
That's a problem in the rendering, I think. It calculates weather you've been hit or not, then it renders the frame. If I change the order, it should be better with the spikes, I think. Maybe. I'll try later, but I'm too lazy at the moment :P

This was untrue...

I did fix the bug, however, but decreasing the left-right detection area to fit the size of the actual sprite (6x8) instead of the 8x8 that I had before...

Seen here:

(http://img.ourl.ca//BUGFIX_COLLISIONS.gif)

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Deep Toaster on December 17, 2013, 10:47:43 pm
This is looking really nice. Any plans to convert it to white-on-black instead? There should be no speed difference and I think it would look truer to the original.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 18, 2013, 07:11:23 am
IMO you should change the saving point sprite to tell the player he actually saved. Looking really nice anyway :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 07:23:32 am
Matref: Yeah, I have the data for that sprite, but I've been too lazy to implement it.

DT: Is there a one-time-per-loop command that will let me do that?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 18, 2013, 07:25:10 am
Do DrawInv right after you draw your tilemap and replace all Pt-Ons by Pt-Changes and you should be good.

EDIT : if you're using DispGraphClrDraw and redraw everything each loop iteration, just add  DrawInv before DispGraphClrDraw.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 07:26:06 am
Do DrawInv right after you draw your tilemap and remplace all Pt-Ons by Pt-Changes and you should be good.

Okay! Will do for the next update!

EDIT: UPDATE!!!

(http://img.ourl.ca//White_On_Black.gif)

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 18, 2013, 07:46:04 am
Now that is looking awesome O.O I like the negativeness :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 18, 2013, 07:47:39 am
Fastest update ever :P

It's true that it's better this way !
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 07:53:44 am
No, I think this next one is. It's a pseudo-bugfix/optimization. I made it so that the player is no longer translucent.

No screenies atm, but the zip is attached. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on December 18, 2013, 09:01:47 am
I like the new color scheme. It makes it look a lot more like the original. :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 04:06:19 pm
Added a poll asking what I should be working on for the next chunk of updates.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 08:10:46 pm
Whelp, I just realized that the updated binaries weren't in the last two updates, just the updated sources D:

Attached is a corrected zip. As always, enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on December 18, 2013, 09:32:08 pm
Are you going to add room names?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 18, 2013, 09:36:22 pm
Perhaps, but that's actually at the bottom of my priority list. It's an embellishment. Not necessarily needed, although very tempting. My priorities are making a complete game, then doing all the embellishments.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 19, 2013, 05:02:49 pm
IMO you should start by porting all of the game's tilemaps =]
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 19, 2013, 05:06:31 pm
I have already said this, but it's probably not clear.

I won't be porting more than a little bit of the original game's tilemap because I'm trying to keep things creative. This will take a lot of time, but I think that the finished product, being different than the original game, will be worth it :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 19, 2013, 05:07:14 pm
Well, I do need moar tilemaps anyway :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 19, 2013, 05:12:12 pm
It depends on the poll results as of 10 mins from now...

/me will start marathon code then.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 22, 2013, 09:45:52 am
Bug found :

(http://img.ourl.ca//bug.gif)

It's just a room I created for some tests.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 22, 2013, 10:02:35 am
oh gosh darnit.

I'll try to fix it ASAP, but I won't be able to be on the computer much today...

Can you PM me the PIMAP.8xv variable, please? That way I can test this.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 22, 2013, 12:23:58 pm
Bug fixed and new level (by Matref)

(http://img.ourl.ca/Thanks_Matref.gif)

I can't get it in Wabbit :P

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on December 22, 2013, 12:39:16 pm
holy, you are insane o.o
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 22, 2013, 12:43:38 pm
I only had to change one "if" statement.

If you look at my code, it appears sloppy at first glance and doesn't have any comments.
It's actually not that sloppy (IMO, look at it yourself :P), and it doesn't have any comments because (even though it's bad practice) I know where a bug is the second I see the bug. Down to the line.

I'm not insane, trust me.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 22, 2013, 12:56:39 pm
That's getting better and better. Btw, in this version, can we play more levels or just the one shown in the screenshot?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 23, 2013, 01:20:01 pm
So I made a slight modification to that level (just where you enter it), and it should be ready by the next release.

And DJ, yeah, that was the only added level...

Matref also made me an on-calc tilemapper specific to the game :D

A million thanks to him!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 23, 2013, 01:23:09 pm
You're welcome, I hope it makes editing levels easier :)

Also, will the game have enemies to avoid ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 23, 2013, 01:33:34 pm
That is undecided, since this is a platform/reflex puzzler. Maybe. Maybe not. I don't know at this point.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 23, 2013, 01:35:45 pm
Okay, because I wasn't sure if there were enemies in the original.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on December 23, 2013, 01:36:36 pm
Glad to hear about the tilemapper, it should be much easier to create levels. :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on December 23, 2013, 01:38:18 pm
Okay, because I wasn't sure if there were enemies in the original.

There were a few level-specific "touch and you die" enemies in the original, but they really are level specific.

Glad to hear about the tilemapper, it should be much easier to create levels. :)

Not only that, but Matref is going to be helping me with custom level support!
Once again, a million thanks!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on December 23, 2013, 03:14:20 pm
Thank me when it'll be done, not now :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 22, 2014, 02:59:34 pm
(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVV_VVV.gif)

No intro necessary on that level :P

As you see, I simplified the level a bit to make it slightly easier compared to the original version. The path will split off to be nonlinear before said level, I promise :D (This is the one level that is easier in Wabbit than on calc...)

Here's the level editor matref made for me:

(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVVME_Matref.gif)

IMPORTANT:

You must select "New" if you had a previous version on your calculator because the save file has new data structure. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Zip is causing problems when I try to post this post, so it's on Dropbox: https://www.dropbox.com/s/1evlzgkrn118tpu/VVVVVV.zip
Enjoy!

EDIT: added missing portion
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on January 22, 2014, 03:03:14 pm
That editor is looking nice! :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on January 23, 2014, 01:06:05 am
That looks great but hard without transitions between screens. Will you consider adding transitions ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 23, 2014, 08:19:26 am
I don't know what you are saying. Are you talking about the level editor, or the game?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on January 23, 2014, 09:09:40 am
In the game, when you go from one room to another. Will you add transitions between rooms ? I can't remember if there are in the original version.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on January 23, 2014, 09:11:01 am
There aren't room transitions in the computer version.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on January 23, 2014, 10:08:08 am
In the game, when you go from one room to another. Will you add transitions between rooms ? I can't remember if there are in the original version.
Yeah that. It is kind of difficult to see where you're going when the next screen just pops out of nowhere.

There aren't room transitions in the computer version.
That doesn't mean he can't improve his version ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on January 23, 2014, 10:11:25 am
In the game, when you go from one room to another. Will you add transitions between rooms ? I can't remember if there are in the original version.
Yeah that. It is kind of difficult to see where you're going when the next screen just pops out of nowhere.
IIRC, some parts of the game take advantage of the screen border jump. (I can't check right now)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 23, 2014, 12:42:08 pm
bb010g's spot on here. Transitions may make the game harder/slower paced, and most levels span multiple screens. I'm trying not to change the mechanics of the original here, but thanks for the suggestion.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on January 24, 2014, 12:27:36 pm
In the game, when you go from one room to another. Will you add transitions between rooms ? I can't remember if there are in the original version.
Yeah that. It is kind of difficult to see where you're going when the next screen just pops out of nowhere.
IIRC, some parts of the game take advantage of the screen border jump. (I can't check right now)
Yeah some games do that. One example from mine are the older Illusiat games that supported tilemaps and the three ROL games. Since the map data was usually just one map for the entire dungeon or floor, there were often walls blocking your path on the next screen which you couldn't see from where you are. The maps were often designed to have secret paths using this as an advantage.

But yeah I think VVVVVV should stay true to the original if possible. If scrolling is added, it might make it too easy and if transitions are added, it might make it too slow-paced.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: chickendude on January 25, 2014, 01:26:52 am
Btw, pi-math-brainiac (:D), i believe WabbitEmu has speed settings. You can try setting the speed to 50% or even 25% to make going through levels easier. The screenshot should show up normally (at 100%). The part in the first screenshot on this page is just wild! :O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 25, 2014, 09:04:23 am
Thanks for the tip!

That will be used in the future!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on January 25, 2014, 04:58:44 pm
Yeah that's how I made certain calculator screenshots back in 2010-11 where gameplay seemed pretty much impossible. Although it doesn't match a debugger with memory view, it can still produce some decent tool-assisted speedruns. :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 29, 2014, 05:34:04 pm
(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVVCME.gif)

Custom maps work! :w00t:

Not much else added/changed, and there's no Readme atm, but expect more within a week!

Zip attached, as always, enjoy!

EDIT: Yes, the executable is DCS only, sorry!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on January 29, 2014, 08:20:55 pm
Wait, does it mean it will support external levels?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 29, 2014, 08:22:41 pm
Well, yes and no.

If you define "levels" as entire maps, then yes.
If you define "levels" as groups of rooms/single rooms added to the main map, then no.

Basically, the support for custom levels is like that of portal prelude.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on January 30, 2014, 02:05:57 am
EDIT: Yes, the executable is DCS only, sorry!
Why DCS only ? ???
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 30, 2014, 10:12:48 am
For four reasons:
1: Crabcake requires shell usage
2: MirageOS uses L2
3: It has an icon
4: You can always compile it for Ion yourself :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on January 30, 2014, 10:24:41 am
1: Crabcake requires shell usage
Ion and MirageOS work fine.

2: MirageOS uses L2
It is written in the Commands.html how to avoid that.

3: It has an icon
Same if compiled for MirageOS. There's even a way to have an icon in a Ion program, see all programs by thepenguin77. MAybe just let the "#Icon()" command and compile for Ion. Moreover, the icon is useless if you use any homerun hook, which I do (and I am surely not the only one to do so).

4: You can always compile it for Ion yourself :P
I can, but other people don't know how to do so (not talking about people on forums).

5: Nothing prevents you from doing several executables, one for Ion (for people who don't care about the icon) and one for DCS if you really want that icon.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on January 30, 2014, 10:26:41 am
I just realized that there is no interrupt in the program

/me facepalms

I'll upload some recompiled versions soon

EDIT: Zip attached
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 07, 2014, 11:19:52 pm
Bump!

So more than a week has passed, and I don't have an update. Sorry D:

I've been a bit too busy with school to even do Ti-Concours, so my next update will probably just include a new README.

Until then, thanks for supporting the project this far!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on February 08, 2014, 04:44:11 am
No problem. I am looking forward to the readme :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 08, 2014, 09:51:26 am
Well, here's an update with a bugfix and a readme!

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ClrDraw on February 08, 2014, 09:56:57 am
I just played this game for the first time and it's addictig  :thumbsup: good work.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 09, 2014, 09:42:56 am
Thanks!

Would you believe that the map is only about 15% done at this point?
It is. Expect more soon, because there will be more tilemap within a week.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 11, 2014, 12:05:58 am
I should probably give this a try at some point. I just downloaded it now, but I think I'll need some practice since it looked very hard lol.

How many maps are there in total?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 12:08:02 am
1 map of 100 rooms. I have about 15-20 rooms released at the moment, and have some more not released yet. Thanks for the download, and feel free to give some critical feedback! :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 11, 2014, 12:29:40 am
Ah ok, yeah I was wondering about rooms themselves. 100 seems quite great actually :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 12:33:53 am
And custom maps can have up to 100 rooms as well.

Once I document the custom maps well enough, I think we might see some people trying things out. That would be cool!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on February 11, 2014, 12:34:55 am
Is the 100 room limit arbitrary, or is there a speed problem with more?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 12:36:16 am
More of a size problem as well as an "I'm too lazy to take user input instead of key-presses" for the custom map width and height.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 11, 2014, 01:03:03 am
Although 100 rooms is kinda a good amount when you take in account the fact that Metroid II: Expansion has 300. You spend much more time in a VVVVVV room than a 83+ xLIB Metroid II one so the length will most likely be identical since players will need weeks before they can get past certain rooms.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 01:08:33 am
All part of the game, eh?

Harder than playing the levels is creating them, though. It normally takes me a week to get a ~3 room section of the map ready, but this week I'm aiming for doubling the existing length.

So expect maybe half the existing length added :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 11, 2014, 01:15:31 am
What do you mean by all part of the game? ???
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 01:18:40 am
The difficulty.

The game's supposed to be extremely hard. I guess it's my fault for not clarifying :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 11, 2014, 01:23:45 am
Oh ok, but yeah the high difficulty will definitively increase the game length. :P In Metroid II: Evolution/The Last Chozo Expansion Set, it's pretty much an exploration-oriented platformer that isn't necessarily meant to be very hard, so you can sometimes find yourself walking through a very long tunnel with very few obstacles. Also, in Metroid II Evolution you can have up to 1099 energy points and in Expansion it's 1499 (pretty much 3598 with the armor). In VVVVVV, one hit and you're dead (although in Metroid you restart all the way back to the last save point if you die).

Just make sure to not make rooms repetitive, such as having 10 rooms worth of moving platform jumping like in that SNES RPG >.<
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 11, 2014, 04:43:50 pm
The original game's designed not to be repetitive. I will do my best not to make it repetitive. The map design's nonlinear at this point :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 14, 2014, 07:49:39 am
So far, the map has 2 paths. In this update, a lot is added to both (although one's much harder at this point :P).

(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVV_THIS_IS_HARD.gif)

EDIT: The above screenshot is with wabbit at 50%, btw.

(http://img.ourl.ca/VVVVVV_SUCH_LEVEL.gif)

Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: TIfanx1999 on February 14, 2014, 08:00:16 am
Holy wall of spikes Batman! O.O
Title: Re: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 16, 2014, 02:36:57 pm
in that 2nd screenshot, would it be possible to just switch gravity to move up but when touching the vertical line, rather than cross it to touch the horizontal one, go back straight into the pit?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 16, 2014, 02:41:00 pm
Yeah, but it's slightly less obvious to the player.
In the actual game, there are many ways to solve each level. :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on February 17, 2014, 12:35:35 pm
How are you supposed to do that O.Os
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on February 17, 2014, 12:44:21 pm
With skill. Fortunately, it takes quite a long time to obtain it ;D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Keoni29 on February 18, 2014, 06:02:46 pm
I will put this on my calc next week. I need to pay attention in school this week.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on February 19, 2014, 02:14:09 am
Hmm even at 1% speed in WabbitEmu with motion blur disabled it's still a little hard... O.O

btw suggestion: You need to put the source files in a separate folder or something, because the data appvar was with the source file and at first I thought it was missing  >.<
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 19, 2014, 07:26:12 am
Will do, DJ!

I'm working on more tilemaps and bugfixing/documenting custom maps. Expect more within a week!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on February 22, 2014, 03:54:10 am
I started to optimize your source, and for now, I saved 901 bytes. I didn't optimize all files, and I didn't optimize everything in each file I read so there is still work to do. I gave stupid names to the routines I created, feel free to rename them :P

But what struck me in your code isn't the lack of optimization (Pokemon Topaze at its beginnings was not much better in terms of optimizations), but the organization of your program.

For example, in VVVVSRC, you put your routines in the main loop and put a "If (0)" around it. First of all, the parentheses around the 0 are useless, second of all, you can put a Goto instead of a "If 0", and most of all, you can (must ?) put routines outside the loop. It's a lot more readable and logical.
Same in VVMENU, you put "prgmVVVCSRC" and "prgmVVVVSRC" at the beginning of your program, and those program both start with "Goto EndOfThatProgram", so they are skipped at execution. Well, same story as with the "If (0)", first of all, you can just put "Goto Skip:prgmVVVCSRC:prgmVVVVSRC:Lbl SKIP" to save one Goto, and most of all, you can put those "sub programs" at the end of your program, after the "main" Return so you don't even need any Goto.

Another thing that struck me and prevented me from optimizing sometimes (didn't feel like making your code readable before optimizing) was the (ab)use of unnecessary parentheses, as in "If (({((X+3)/8)+(((Y-1)/8)*12)+GDB1}=2) or ({((X+3)/8)+(((Y+8)/8)*12)+GDB1}=2)".


So, source is attached, try it and tell me what I broke so I find a way to fix it :P
But don't tell me "that part of the game doesn't work", that won't help me. You have to figure out which part of the code doesn't work, because I didn't try to understand every bit of your code ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on February 22, 2014, 08:46:06 am
Thanks for the help!
I'm going to try this in a bit!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on February 24, 2014, 02:19:10 am
Collision detection fixed (for real this time :P).
Outline drawing fixed.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on March 05, 2014, 05:42:41 pm
This:

(http://img.ourl.ca/FEATURE%21.png)

Also: expect an update within a week.
Also also: I'm back! (If you didn't know that already :P)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: aeTIos on March 05, 2014, 05:49:20 pm
Congrats on the feature! You can now say that you have surpassed the 87 1/3.14 % of the community who never got a feature. :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on March 06, 2014, 08:05:26 pm
Congrats for the feature!
This program is awesome :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on April 03, 2014, 02:49:04 pm
I'm late, but congrats on the feature for this. I tried the game but only on an emulator. I need to install it on my calc at one point (I only had Flappy Bird clones before I did a full reset lol)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 05, 2014, 09:50:45 pm
So I was unable to make Hayleia's code work at this point due to a bug with vertical filp-lines. That said, many bugfixes in the custom maps as well as custom maps documentation!


YAYGIMMIEGIMMIE!!!


No screenies atm, because there are no new levels. This will be uploaded to ticalc later in the week.


Zip attached, as always. Enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Hayleia on May 06, 2014, 01:45:52 am
Sorry about that bug. I may have been a bit care-free when optimizing :P
I think it's more that I didn't know all the features and what part of the code was producing which feature so I could not test thoroughly enough when optimizing (so I made basic tests and saw that the game was mostly working :P).
However, I don't know if you completely went back to your old code, but I think that at least basic optimizations (the ones that don't change the number/order of lines in the main code) are appliable with little risk :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 15, 2014, 05:41:36 pm
I went completely back, sadly. I will make most of those optimizations before the next release, though.

Announcement time!
I have set a deadline for finishing this project: August 1st. It will be done before then, I promise. Next week is my last week of the school year, and I will get it done before school starts next year :D
Thanks for the support so far. Update soon, I promise!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 15, 2014, 06:03:53 pm
Ah lucky you. Still 1.5 month left for me. :/
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 17, 2014, 03:03:01 pm
Made a few optimizations, and it's much faster and harder >:D
More optimizations to follow (trying to reduce on size next, so I don't have to use Crabcake)!
Also: MOS and Ion versions available again!


Screenie proof:


(http://img.ourl.ca/FAST.gif)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ClrDraw on May 17, 2014, 05:57:38 pm
I love this game, good work!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 17, 2014, 05:58:51 pm
It's looking great indeed :)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 17, 2014, 06:11:01 pm
New game mode: Insane mode! Every time it is possible to flip gravity, it is done automatically. No pressing 2nd here.
Note: This takes the same save file from normal mode, and will only create a new one if no save file exists.

Screenie:

(http://img.ourl.ca/Insane.gif)


Zip attached, enjoy!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 17, 2014, 06:12:35 pm
Holy, that is insane O.O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 17, 2014, 06:34:54 pm
It should enable 15Mhz mode. :trollface:
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 17, 2014, 07:32:44 pm
No. :P I've tried the game in 15Mhz mode, and it's impossible.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 18, 2014, 04:11:06 am
It is possible, you only need insane reflexes :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 18, 2014, 04:19:39 am
^That. :P That's what insane should be anyway.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 18, 2014, 09:05:32 am
But then it wouldn't work on the regular 83+ :P I'm trying to make sure everyone with an 8x can play this game.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 18, 2014, 09:14:11 am
Bleh, it's just partial incompatibility. :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 18, 2014, 09:16:33 am
Here's a screenie at full:
(http://img.ourl.ca/FullVVVVVV.gif)


I also tried this on-calc :P
I'll make a poll.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 18, 2014, 09:32:39 am
Voted for 2). It's so damn epic. O.O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 18, 2014, 09:52:32 am
That is so awesome O.O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: ClrDraw on May 18, 2014, 12:15:03 pm
Same, its crazy  O.O
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on May 18, 2014, 12:24:35 pm
As the owner of a TI-83+ BE, I can't vote for 15 MHz mode <_<
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 18, 2014, 12:27:34 pm
/me prods Matref to buy more calcs
I mean, you have two Nspire, don't tell me you can't afford the new 83+fr USB. :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on May 18, 2014, 12:34:33 pm
I don't have two Nspires, I have one TI-Nspire CAS <_< the only calculator I bought (not even with my money) is my TI-83+.fr (2010). I won the TI-Nspire CAS and TI-84+CSE to various contests.

And if I could buy a calc, that would be a TI-Nspire CX CAS (as long as it's Ndless-compatible).
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 18, 2014, 12:36:54 pm
Wut I thought you had a CX ?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Matrefeytontias on May 18, 2014, 12:38:29 pm
You thought wrong. I'd want one though, for crafti/nDoom/nKaruga awesomeness.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Eiyeron on May 19, 2014, 02:27:00 am
Meh, why not adding a Maniac mode, where both options are enabled? :D
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 19, 2014, 06:59:35 am
Do want. *slimes*
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 19, 2014, 08:52:39 am
Meh, why not adding a Maniac mode, where both options are enabled? :D
Not enough space for the menu option :P

In the next update, it will do a check at the beginning of execution for the model. If the calc is a 15Mhz calc, it will do insane mode in Full, else, it will do insane mode as is.

EDIT: 1200 posts!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Eiyeron on May 19, 2014, 08:55:22 am
Not enough space for the menu option :P

KONAMI CODE!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Sorunome on May 19, 2014, 09:25:40 am
Not enough space for the menu option :P
some kind of hidden thingy, where you have to press a key combo :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Streetwalrus on May 19, 2014, 11:40:30 am
That's what Eiyeron said : Konami code. ;)
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Geekboy1011 on May 19, 2014, 06:09:55 pm
Actaully the asm code for full is coded in a way that it selects the maximum _Available_ speed. This means on a regular 83+ it will choose 6mhz on an 84+se it will choose speed mode 3. Or for most people 15mhz

If you have an overclocked 83+se well it will choose 23mhz. Good luck ;)


also make full mode enterable via konamicode on the menu because why the hell not. Or makebe make a cheats menu and make a few input based cheats like noclip(spikes dont kill) change grav anywhere and stuff could be fun?
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 19, 2014, 06:17:04 pm
I'll see what I can do about the Konami code and the extra menu! :D

Long story short, insane will stay the way it is, but I'll have a Konami code cheats menu for the next release!
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: bb010g on May 19, 2014, 09:13:03 pm
The original VVVVVV did have invincibility & speed adjustments.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: DJ Omnimaga on May 19, 2014, 10:50:15 pm
The new mode looks crazy O.O

Also if you add konami code, you could just be nasty and make it do the opposite of what it's supposed to do: Instead of make the game easier, it would make it even harder, like I did in the fake Zelda CSE game :P
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: Eiyeron on May 20, 2014, 02:03:52 am
The new mode looks crazy O.O

Also if you add konami code, you could just be nasty and make it do the opposite of what it's supposed to do: Instead of make the game easier, it would make it even harder, like I did in the fake Zelda CSE game :P

DJ O, I given the Konami Code idea only to enable "Maniac" Mode, Full Speed + nonstop gravity switch! :p
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on May 20, 2014, 07:40:48 am
The new mode looks crazy O.O

Also if you add konami code, you could just be nasty and make it do the opposite of what it's supposed to do: Instead of make the game easier, it would make it even harder, like I did in the fake Zelda CSE game :P

Actually, there will be options to make it easier or harder. Still working on it, though.
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: pimathbrainiac on June 03, 2014, 05:27:44 pm
Progress Update:

I'm going to just add another menu with no Konami code. I can't get it to work with the Konami code :P
That said, the next update will not come this week due to being busy. Sorry D:
Title: Re: VVVVVV
Post by: aeTIos on June 03, 2014, 05:41:02 pm
You can't get up up up right down left left left up right left down down down left right left right up down to work? awww.