Omnimaga
Calculator Community => Other Calculators => Topic started by: contra-sh on December 03, 2011, 06:43:06 am
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Here is the place for the basic judges.
Here's the list of judges :
- YeongJIN_COOL
- Le solutionneur (responsable/chief)
- parser padawan
- epic 7
- matrefeytontias
- llylud
Discussion between the judges should be here.
Remember, you should not publish results before refering to deeph or myself.
But you can give your opinion, talk about programs... :)
Be sure to post here, deeph and myself don't want to look in all the forum of the world to find you :p
Of course, asm and hybrid team judges categories topic are not here (cemetech and yaronet).
There's one "chief" for this team : Le solutionneur.
You will find the final archive containing all the basic project here : http://david.nathalie.perso.sfr.fr/zcontest/
Rules are enclosed in the archives.
Let's time to works judges !
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Good luck all judges : I'm myself judging right now.
First :
-absolute madness is too slow on 83 plus calculators
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Me too, and I see that many people didn't include a readme and no any rules >_<
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Me too, and I see that many people didn't include a readme and no any rules >_<
What do you mean with rules?
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I said that in nearly 20 zip files, I saw 8 readmes.
EDIT : the rules of the contest say that we <b>must</b> include readme
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Sorry for the double post, but I change of subject ;D
I tested 3 games, and they are all sloooooooooow ...
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D: Good luck BASIC programmer?!
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No, they're REALLY slow
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It is TI-BASIC after all XD
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Yes of course, but I have already seen faster Ti-Basic programs ;D
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I've tested the worms and it's very fast, the mountains generation is good, there is high plains and some high mountains.
This one has included the readme, and the game itself is great : you can for example fight against IA or play with IA : you can have 2 IA in your team and 1 human player.
You can also ask IA to fight themselves against themselves.
Best worms as far !
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I saw that while judging you have to also judge this: "-Life : /5"
What is meant with Life?
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I saw that while judging you have to also judge this: "-Life : /5"
What is meant with Life?
That category equates to what I'd call "replayability." Basically, after you finished the game do you want to go back and play through the entire game or parts of the game.
Also, since I'm posting in here, I figured I'd say a couple of things about speed:
-absolute madness is too slow on 83 plus calculators
I'd argue against that. For one thing, it was programmed on a TI-83+, which proves that it's ultimately playable on it. I believe the question you guys need to ask is "do the amount of features a program has justify its slower speed." For instance, Midnight has quite a few features if I do say so myself, but it's also pretty sluggish. Remember that this is TI-Basic, after all, and that speed is something that will hamper most programs.
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Lifetime is maybe the right word for "Life":
- How long to finish the game (longer is, best it is)
- How hard is the game, the difficulty is not too hard, not too weak (it's also a part of the "gameplay")
- Does it sufficient easy to give the possibility to finish the game?
do the amount of features a program has justify its slower speed
+1
I've tested the games that they are talking about and, I was _not_ surprised by the relative slowness. Because each time I've played it, I was asking how each part was done, and I know how it's hard to simply "move a sprite, test collision, print a background and move some ennemies" quickly. In fact only move a sprite with keypress handling + handle ai require to loose the most part of the speedness.
But probably all the games will be slow in basic. Only simple games could be speed.
But in other hand, I understand that basic programmers should not add to much functionnality to keep a good gameplay.
And I understand that judges could be a little annoyed by this, even if they completely respect the incredibles programmation skills of the authors.
(Which is the case of the games we are talking about !)
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Worms land is great o_O
Fast, beautiful ... he's a good chance for the contest !
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Yeah I agree that BASIC games shouldn't be judged entirely for their speed. IMHO 2 frames per second minimum is ok for a simple 83+ game and 2 on a 15 MHz calc for a complex game. Below that it can be a problem, though, especially in platform games, because of key detection lag making it harder to control your character.
Btw are games with no readme disqualified? Although this might be a rash decision to do so if someone spent lots of effort on an entry, I think this would teach people a lesson to force them to include a readme in their future games. When I download something on ticalc.org and TI-Planet I like to be able to know how to use it, which is impossible if no instructions are included, and most file archives on the web requires people to include a txt readme with their file. :/
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I think judges should not take care in their grades if there's a readme or not. Because it's a problem due to the contest rules (even if this is written in the rules). This is not a part of the project qualities...
However, I know that it's quite annoying when there's not readme, that's true.
DJ_O: I hope there's no problem, I choose your forum for the basic asm judge headquarter without asking you...
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That's not just a <b>little</b> problem, there is a game which I couldn't play because I didn't know commands ; I had to find commands and goals by myself, and procure a bad image of the program (it's TiTron)
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Maybe they forgot to add a readme?
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Probably, but forgot or not forgot, if they don't include a readme the result is tge same
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I think it would be fair if you asked those authors to write up a README, and then deduct a small amount of points for not having it. That way, their hard work doesn't go to waste, and that the rules (with the consequences) of having a README are honored. :)
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Yay ! I wrote a readme in two languages :w00t:
But (for the others) what if they included a "how to play" section in their entries ?
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The rules specified that we must include a readme in the zip file, not in the project page.
For programmers who didn't include readme, we decide with Ilylude that we deduct one point (for me it's too less) of the total score. If they include a how-to-play, it count like a readme, so there isn't any problem
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And since I'm the chief of the basic judgment, I declare officially that the rules were clear, and so, if there is no readme/how to play file in the folder of the game/tool, the project will get a punishment of 1 point. That's not much, but for us judges, it takes an incredibly extra time to judge.
I think -1 point is fair, next time, you guys should include a readme.
I will ask contra-sh for approval, but it should be done so.
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I agree, in an entire afternoon I tested 3 programs !!!
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I think that the most important thing to win the contest is to find the compromise between speed and features. I think that all contestants could add more features on their project if they wanted, but it is their choice not to do that, because they think adding more features would make the game unplayable.
That's why I think it is absurd to think that the amount of features can be a justification to the slowness of the game.
Please excuse me for my poor english!
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Yes, the amount of features doesn't justify the slowness.
I think that if a program is slow in menus, tht's not the worst : the most important is in the game itself (unless if this is really slow like in minesweaper : every time you start a new game, a slow image shows up, what's a pity : on ti 83 calculators, it takes time...)
Ps: you, which program do you gived the best note ?
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Me?? I'm not a judge, but a simple candidate, hoping to find out what you think of my project, mario :). By the way, you have abandoned your "fun snake" project?
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Your "poor English" which is better than mine is excused because I'm French xD
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Me too! I mean poor English because I think I used like four times " I think" and " features" in one post.
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I said "poor english" because I used like four times " I think " and " feature " in one post!!
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Yes, but since I didn't know there was a contest, I had no enough time to finish it.
Your Mario is amusing but take a huge time at the beginning, that's pity !
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Yep, and you may say "I said bad English" because "I mean bad English" means nothing :p
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Ok. Have you tried my mario on a ti 84+ ? It is really fast...
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I have only a Ti-83+, sorry
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Suggestion: Use WabbitEmu (and Rom8x to dump a rom from your calc for use with the emulator) and set the speed around 200%. This will give you an idea of how fast the game will run normally on a 84+ model, although certain parts might be slightly slower).
And yeah making a BASIC game very fast is extremely hard and making an action game is even more harder. Even when using libraries it's still slow. An example would be my Metroid II game and Reuben Quest (although Reuben used plenty of outdated library commands). This is why I often thought making an RPG was one of the easiest kind of BASIC project, but making an RPG takes so incredibly long and you need to have played a lot of '90s RPGs)
@Contra-sh there is no problem. It can be in one of the contest threads, this one or of course you can comment directly in the respective project threads. Just as long as game criticism, negative or positive, is made within the forums rules and not like "ur game sux u should kill urself" ;D
About games with no instructions, IMHO there should be a penalty on gameplay if you have troubles figuring out how to play. In fact in the previous Omnimaga contests there were and this is why entries like Splut and Cube Droid Save the Galaxy lost a lot of points in the "gameplay" category and even costed a 3rd place win to Ikkerens.
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About games with no instructions, IMHO there should be a penalty on gameplay if you have troubles figuring out how to play. In fact in the previous Omnimaga contests there were and this is why entries like Splut and Cube Droid Save the Galaxy lost a lot of points in the "gameplay" category and even costed a 3rd place win to Ikkerens.
Yeah, I learned my lesson on that one, though I didn't have time to write one anyway. :/ (Cube Droid was my entry.)
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Actually personally I hate writing readmes. If I absolutely need one I would just write the controls and a quick summary on how to play and that's it, just so people don't have to figure out.
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Or if you don't write any readme, make it obvious in-game how to play, like most flash games.
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No discussions : we give a penalty of 1 point. That's few : 0,5 point of 20
Secondly : "although certain
parts might be slightly slower" <--- no, if you run a ti-83 plus at 200%, you get 6x2 =12MHz. The ti 84 is a 15 MHz.
Personaly, I use a real ti 83 calculator : otherwise, the gameplay is not the same.
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Ok.
I firstly said that giving a penalty for a missing readme is not a good idea because maybe it was our fault (staff member) and not really the fault of the contestant.
But...
Regarding the wasting time to understand the goal of a game and the keybindings.
Regarding what the judges are thinking and DJ_O and some other people here.
Regarding it was clearly announced in the rules.
Regarding Le solutionneur is the one who decides for this judge team.
There's no problem to give this penalty.
And, according to the fact the total mark is /40, this penalty should probably not give any problem for the podium :)
@Contra-sh there is no problem. It can be in one of the contest threads, this one or of course you can comment directly in the respective project threads. Just as long as game criticism, negative or positive, is made within the forums rules and not like "ur game sux u should kill urself"
Totally agree with you. I don't want to see too much negative comment. Because the first goal of this contest is to be funny. Some contestant said : " I'm not really good, I don't want to participate" and I answered : "Don't worry, this contest is not only intended for elite, don't worry, we will not criticize you." So respect is the most important word :)
Personaly, I use a real ti 83 calculator : otherwise, the gameplay is not the same.
Testing on real calc is always the best way to see the speed :)
Maybe all the judges can't test on real calc but each program should be tested on real calc if possible at least one time.
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The screenshot in my archive is for 1.3.3 version ; why did contra decide put it with the 1.4.3 version ?
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Just taken from zcontest project page without looking which version it was :)
An old screenshot is better than no screenshot at all, isn't it?
But if you prefer I drop it ? Just tell me.
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No discussions : we give a penalty of 1 point. That's few : 0,5 point of 20
Secondly : "although certain
parts might be slightly slower" <--- no, if you run a ti-83 plus at 200%, you get 6x2 =12MHz. The ti 84 is a 15 MHz.
Personaly, I use a real ti 83 calculator : otherwise, the gameplay is not the same.
Well people were just giving suggestions and their view on the penalty subject. No need to be rude at us for suggesting stuff. (Telling us "No discussion" basically means we need to shut up)
Also I ran tests with emulators in the past to compare a 83+ running twice faster with a TI-83 Plus Silver Edition at 100% speed and barely saw any difference in TI-BASIC, providing the program drew stuff on the screen. Due to LCD delays I guess this is what gives the impression that BASIC games seem to run at 12 MHz instead of 15. I just remember from experience that my BASIC programs would never seem to run at the full 15 MHz on 15 MHz calcs. Hence why I suggested trying at 200% speed.
If my BASIC programs really ran 2.5 times faster on 15 MHz calcs than the 83+, do you think I would have suggested that? No.
Le Solutioneur tu devrais faire attention comment tu traites les gens ou comment tu t'exprimes sur ce forum. Il y a 7 mois je crois, tu t'étais presque fait bannir d'Omnimaga à cause d'un malentendu qui avait l'air d'un troll contre les programmeurs TI et aussi pour essayer de décider ce qui est permis ou pas sur Omnimaga.
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Ok ok, please keep cool :)
This basically not the goal of this thread, please. There's just a little misunderstanding.
When I said :
Regarding Le solutionneur is the one who decides for this judge team.
I would say that he has a little more power than the other judges. But I would love to hear the opinion of YeonJIN_COOL, epic7 and parser padawan about this subject (penalty).
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Oh I meant everyone who commented to the thread and gave their views or suggestions, not just the judges
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Yes, of course, I totally agree with you.
And that's why this thread is not a private thread :)
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Sorry for the missunderstood, I was writting as quickly as possible and since my english is really bad, this gave a post that had to be missunderstood.
Of course the other guys can give their ideas. (althought the name of the topic is "judges headquarter")
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Et pour le "presque" banni : j'ai dit que l'axe était une horreur au niveau optimisation mais c'est tout à fait vrai et je maintiens toujours cet opinion.
Cela va sans dire que je programme en Ti basic et en l’occurrence, également en assembleur et que cela ne signifie nullement que je suis contre la communauté ou je ne sais quoi. En même temps, l'appli axe ne prend que deux pages, mais peut-être aurait-il été nécessaire de faire une application pc qui optimise bien plus car la mémoire n'est pas aussi cruciale.
Ah oui, dans le 3 quarts des forums, on met des avertissements et on n'est pas aussi strict que ça, mais bon, si c'est les règles de ce forum.
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pop.
Did I mentioned that the 5 packs of math should be run by individual programs?
also, absolute madness have a bug that if you get too much heart pieces, it gives you ERR:DOMAIN
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Yeah, me I put in my file notes.txt "the launcher is bugging"
Also, in Physic jumper the free play doesn't run.
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Sorry for the missunderstood, I was writting as quickly as possible and since my english is really bad, this gave a post that had to be missunderstood.
Of course the other guys can give their ideas. (althought the name of the topic is "judges headquarter")
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Et pour le "presque" banni : j'ai dit que l'axe était une horreur au niveau optimisation mais c'est tout à fait vrai et je maintiens toujours cet opinion.
Cela va sans dire que je programme en Ti basic et en l’occurrence, également en assembleur et que cela ne signifie nullement que je suis contre la communauté ou je ne sais quoi. En même temps, l'appli axe ne prend que deux pages, mais peut-être aurait-il été nécessaire de faire une application pc qui optimise bien plus car la mémoire n'est pas aussi cruciale.
Ah oui, dans le 3 quarts des forums, on met des avertissements et on n'est pas aussi strict que ça, mais bon, si c'est les règles de ce forum.
Reste que Quigibo a passé beaucoup de temps et effort sur Axe et que Axe est l'unique raison pourquoi il y a plus de programmeurs TI qu'avant (sans Axe, il y aurait la moitié des projets existants et encore moins de programmeurs ASM, étant donné que beaucoup de programmeurs Axe ont utilisé Axe comme un pont vers l'ASM. Aussi le but d'Axe v1.x était d'être on-calc, donc des compromis ont du être fait. Je ne crois pas que c'est bien de dire qu'Axe c'est nul et ne vaut rien juste à cause que ça n'optimise pas autant que du vrai ASM, par contre. Pour un APP PC, c'était prévu pour Axe II anyway, mais je n'ai plus entendu de nouvelles à propos de ça.
Anyway back on topic, would it be possible, once all programs are tested, for the judges to do a quick summary of their opinions about each programs in one post each afterward? It might be easier for those who don't read the topic often, although you're free to give your views as you test too.
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For the opinion : for each project unless tools, I've done a quick summary of what the greats points of the game, what's not.
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I've done that for like 7 programs (6 english, 1 french :D )
Want me to post it here?
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I think I need to play them all first, then rate them, or rate them, play them, then change them because I don't really have a good concept of what a good basic game is.
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If anyone wants me to, I can post some of them and you guys can criticize.
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Ok :thumbsup:
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ok... Here it goes!
Contest Entry #1 : Midnight
Classified as: TI-BASIC Game
Author: ztrumpet (Zachery Tuller)
Grading:
-Gameplay: 14/15
I would like to give a lot of points for scenario and interface. Midnight is a platforming game with not-common-storyline (It's not like, "Oh. My princess got captured by some evil dude. I must run around and find my princess without getting any reward." :P ) The difficulty wasn't high, so it could be played and beat by a lot of people, too. However, what I didn't like about this game was the ending. Sure, you get some "extra" scene(I refuse to spoil it) if you collect all the items, but it was just not enough for me. D: Therefore, 14/15
-Smooth, Speed of execution: 5/5
Like most of the TI-BASIC games, speed can be quite slow than the other category. This game is not an exception. Sure. This game is not smooth and not fast. However, this is TI-BASIC game and considering what's going on in this game, I think that the speed is acceptable.(The game could be harder if it was faster O.O) So, 5/5.
-Graphics: 5/5
This is the only game that uses dual-layered ASCII graphics in zcontset! :D The idea was really innovative to me and I loved that sinister omega dude. :D 5/5!
-Life: 4/5
Well, I think the only time that person replays this is probably to 100% it. 4/5.
-Originality: 5/5
As I said before, the storyline of this game wasn't like the typical platforming games. Also, I loved the saving place. Also, I haven't seen the game that like this in TI-BASIC before. 5/5 for me!
-Technical Quality: 5/5
Before you nag about this game being huge (almost whole RAM space), think about what's going on in the game. This game support some of the hard features (like grappling hook) and how many rooms it had (21, I think). I think ground pound and grappling hooks were hard to make (at least, for me.) So, despite the huge size of this game, I'm giving it 5/5 for it.
Total: 38/40
Here. now criticize.
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Wow, almost a perfect score O.O And ztrumpet is rather amazing with BASIC XD
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38/40 !!!!!!
the best game I've noted is worms and I gave 34,5/40
This high note is strange... we'll wait the reactions of the others but I think it's not normal to give such high note...
What I think :
Speed: 2/5 : the fact that the program is complex does not justify the slowness.
Gameplay 11/15: although the game is funny, the gameplay is not really awesome.
Life : 3/5 : don't make sense to give 4/5 : the replaybility isn't enough high.
Technical quality 3/5: need too much memory, with many subprograms...
Originality 4/5 :some good ideas but such game already exist although the plot is original
Graphics : 3.5/5: good graphics but not as awesome as you describe.
Final note: 27,5/40
Good game but the slowness, the gameplay and the technical quality could be better.
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@Le solutionneur: which calc are you using? If you're using TI-83BE, yes, it will be slow.
Also, have you beat the game before? because, imo, the size is not so bad considering all the stuff it has in the game.
EDIT: also, 2 subprograms are not a lot. Have you tried Calcul? :)
One more thing: can you describe how you have worms 34.5/40? :D
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I would like it too!
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I'm not on computer : I'll give you this as soon as possible.
I'm really wondering if you're not cheating or something like that with the author of the program...
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Contest Entry #2 : Calc Tron
Classified as: TI-BASIC Game
Author: andy
Grading:
-Gameplay: 8/15
This game is simple. Perhaps, too simple. It's 2 player game in one calc. This doesn't have AI. I could only see this as a modified version of snake game. D:
-Smooth, Speed of execution: 5/5
Well, this game is small, and there's not much going on in the game. Of course, it is really Fast! 5/5
-Graphics: 2/5
I....only see 2 lines in the whole game. D:
-Life: 2/5
This actually could be fun if 2 people are playing it. Since it's an arcade game, this will most probably be played over and over. However, never if only 1 person is playing this.
-Originality: 2/5
Erm....I say this is the ported version of lightbike (or Tron.)
-Technical Quality: 2/5
Simple. Really simple. Of course, because it's simple, the size is small.
Total: 21/40
EDIT: @Le solutionneur. No. I'm telling my experience since I beat this game. :)
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I haven't tried worms land. But midnight is really really impressive. I'm not really surprised to see a good mark for this game.
Anyway, don't forget that some adjustement would be done when all judges will finish their work.
As you know, best project between all categories win a ti nspire cx cas, so if someone gives a 40/40, other projects haven't any chances to win the CX
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As you know, best project between all categories win a ti nspire cx cas, so if someone gives a 40/40, other projects haven't any chances to win the CX
I was under the impression that scores were relative only to their own category, and that you and a few select others would pick the Grand Champion to win the CX. As the contest stands, now that I understand it better, I do agree that it's a little unfair. However, since the ratings in a given category are relative to the judges judging the entries, I think it would work best if you looked at it like I assumed it would be determined, with contra having the ultimate say in which the very best program is. It is very hard to make comparisons across categories, and because of that I would refrain from only looking at the scores to determine the Grand Champion.
Now, this is all my personal opinion; if contra would like to run the contest in a different way, that's certainly fine by me.
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IMHO a program should not be judged based on its file size and amount of sub-program, unless the amount of features is taken into account. Else this is unfair for people who decided to devote more time to their entry to make them better. Would a number guessing game that only takes one sub-program and 300 KB of RAM get a better score than an epic RPG with many files and large size that risks winning a ticalc.org POTY, for example? I think judging a program on its size/amount of sub-programs, regardless of its amount of features, simply discourages development of games with a decent amount of features and it's quite offensive to people who devote more time to their program.
Also I personally take offense in the judging of BASIC games based on file size and amount of sub-programs, considering I devoted 5 years of my life to long lenght BASIC RPGs with lots of features. This attitude is exactly why I gave up on calc programming: I felt disrespected.
As for midnight the note might be a bit biased in favor of the 84+ if that's what he used, otherwise you could maybe check, although you should be careful to not jump to conclusions and falsely accuse people on the forums, especially in public. From what I've seen about midnight, it could possibly deserve a high note, but that depends of people opinion.
IMHO some judges are way too strict about BASIC games here and have a false idea of what is possible in TI-BASIC. I think Le Solutionneur should propose a solution in Midnight thread if he feels the speed can be improved without removing features, otherwise it's rather unrealistic. Let's not bring back the old issues from the late 90s and early 2000s involving judging basic games unfairly (http://ourl.ca/13996).
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Also, in Physic jumper the free play doesn't run.
That is wierd, it works perfectly fine on my calculator. Is it giving you an error or what?
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I've got a Ti-83+.fr and if I run "Free play" this says "ERROR:INVALID DIM" at the line :
*L of List*JMP(2)->G
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On what OS are you guys testing programs btw? I know OS 2.53 MP or higher are quite bad about cross-compatibility with old programs.
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I think the solutionneur is right, you shouldn't give points to easily. What I don't understand is why you give all the points in a category when you say yourself that it isn't perfect!
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Oh, that is a very good point. Keep in mind that the newer OSes are a little slower at a lot of things and have lots of bugs that can cause issues that aren't the programmers fault.
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OK soooo ... I can't do anything -_-' but the game is pretty good
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I've got a Ti-83+.fr and if I run "Free play" this says "ERROR:INVALID DIM" at the line :
*L of List*JMP(2)->G
I did not have any code that looked like that. maybe it has something to do with the .fr calc. Did anyone else have this problem?
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I think the solutionneur is right, you shouldn't give points to easily. What I don't understand is why you give all the points in a category when you say yourself that it isn't perfect!
+1
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ztrumpet : you're right, I will have the last word with deeph on the "Grand champion". In fact, I will test the 3 or more best projects of each categories to know which project is really better. But, if someone has a better mark in hybrid, this is more difficult to choose a basic or asm contestant. But you're right, we can't compare the 3 categories, especially because the judges are not the same :)
About number of subprograms... Well, I'm a developper, and I know that's always better to cut a program between more than one big "main". To separate data/pix from functions, separate main loop from other part too. And it's quite difficult in basic to work on big programs because even with page down (alpha+down) you can loose 10 or 15 second each time to find the part of the program you're working on.
I'm a little bit scary about the (many) misunderstandings and the ambiance here.
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The problem is that in the past there were places (including the old Omni board) where people bashed programs based on file size, and it was like if those programs were worthless to them, and this just discouraged their authors. I just don't want to see this happening here again, plus it's against Omnimaga rules anyway:
2: Commentaires négatifs/agressifs/destructifs injustifié envers le projet d'un membre (comme dénigrer un jeu entier juste pour sa taille de fichier, le nombre de fichiers ou le langage de programmation utilisé même si le jeu est excellent) dans le but de le décourager.
In the past such criticism did discourage people from continuing calc programming. There is a reason why I did not release a single new finished calc game since June 2006.
Anyway if the contest judges file size, then be it. Just do it respectfully for the authors who devoted a lot of time and effort on their games if you post your criticism (negative or positive) here.
As for sub programs the reason why I used them is to avoid code repetition and reduce size. Also it takes incredibly long to scroll down through source code, unless you have Doors CS installed (which Gotos to the error instantly)
What I think right now is that there's a mentality clash between some newcomers in this thread and Omnimaga mentality/vision in general.
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Same error on emulator ti84+se 2.41
Here a little screenshot :
(http://david.nathalie.perso.sfr.fr/calc/gifs/pjmp.gif)
(here's a good example of the time for scrolling a big program :p )
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So that's not an OS compatibility issue then... might be a bug with the program or the author forgot to include a file. Too late for him I guess x.x.
Also I saw worse scrolling lenght. When I coded Illusiat 13 on my 83+ (which i never finished), scrolling through the boss event programs took about 2 minutes. When I had to fix a bug after 12 tries, it became annoying. (Illusiat 13 contained about 50 KB of RPG character conversations)
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You should code on ti editor on ti forge, that's more convenient ;)
If you really want to do it on calculator, you can use doorcs to have more space to edit the program.
For the ambiance, we should all make an effort to be cooler :)
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Looks like it might be a failure of the program to initialize the save list? That can be one bug that is difficult to find in bug testing, since you already have the list on your own calc, you never notice that the program fails to create it on its own.
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Looks like it might be a failure of the program to initialize the save list? That can be one bug that is difficult to find in bug testing, since you already have the list on your own calc, you never notice that the program fails to create it on its own.
Yeah, bugs like that are really frustrating. That's why I occasionally clear my RAM before testing a program, so I can find errors like that.
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In this case, we've to give a penalty of 1 point.
That's not much, just 0,5/20 ;)
@DJ_0: si c'est toi, ne mets pas -1 à tous mes posts, j'ai compris.
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If think not 'cos I already have a not-empty JMP list
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If think not 'cos I already a have a not-empty JMP list
The program must initialize the list under either option 1 or 3 from the main menu, so if you choose option 2 first, it will error. At least, that's what it sounds like to me.
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You should code on ti editor on ti forge, that's more convenient ;)
If you really want to do it on calculator, you can use doorcs to have more space to edit the program.
For the ambiance, we should all make an effort to be cooler :)
I personally never could get used to program on a computer, because from 2001 to 2004 I got used to program 10 hours a day on a calculator, since I did not own a computer at home. Afterward I tried year after year to switch to computer, with no success. I have troubles getting used to new stuff and change of habits. Also as alternative to TI-Forge there's SourceCoder, which added most of TI-Forge features, although it forces you to register to be used, unlike TI editor.
As for ambiance the trick would be that everyone remains respectful towards someone's work regardless of its program size, language used and stuff. In other words not singling out entire groups of programs or people.
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"regardless of its program size" <-- what I said was not critism of the program, what I said is that the contest says in it's rules that the size of the program count and the judge didn't respect that. I didn't said that this program sucks 'cause his size is huge. I think the missinderstood is here.
Anyways, good luck to all programmers ! :)
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Ah ok I see then. I think it's the wording used (and past experiences where people really intended to bash) that might have triggered the misunderstood.
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If you do this on the homescreen it will work, I forgot I set all the lists to one.
5->dim(LJMP
the "L" is the list symbol
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I missed this topic somehow. I would like to say, for those of you that have not graded my "Five Pack Of Math" entry. Please run the programs as seperate programs. Or store 0 to LIst MPACK. If you store 0 to the list you can see the sweet menu feature. If it is too late then Oh well I suppose. Just a heads up. The program works except for the one line that is missing that stores 0 to the List MPACK.
Also thanks to Yeong-JinCool for mentioning that earlier. I just wanted to add about storing 0 to the list so you dont miss the menu feature. I have corrected that. It is a little doubtful I will win based on the amazing reviews I have seen thus far, but the contest isnt done till its done. So a bit late. May the best entry win!
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yeah, maybe there was a problem with my grading style.
This is how I graded: I start with the full score, and whenever I find something unpleasing, I take off 1 point per stuff that I didn't like. also, -1 per bug.
Maybe I should be more detailed and look at the stuff like compatibility issue and stuff. ;)
(According to my grading style, most of the programs have over 30/40)
also, how do I shoot far in worms land? O.o
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Bridge, maybe you shouldn't reveal your rating in public. Otherwise the surprise might go away.
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I posted that so people can criticize my grading style and possibly fix my way. ;)
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Ah, ok :)
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Whoo O.O
all this has happened since I was gone? ;)
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Entry #3: Chasse
Author: noelthebest
Classified as: TI-BASIC game
-Gameplay (ownership, interest, pleasure felt playing the game, interface, scenario ...) : This is my one of my favorite game for TI-BASIC entry, so far. I love the reflex games, so I love this game, too. I think there was a storyline in this game, but it was too simple(I think). It uses keypads, but it seems like that it's almost impossible for me to play difficult mode D: 11/15
-Smooth, speed of execution : This game is FAST! (especially in TI-84+SE), but perhaps it's too fast. 4/5
-Graphics (graphics, interface menu ...) : It just uses standard OS menu, and graphic looks kinda bad at difficult version. 3/5
-Life :replay value? a lot! 5/5
-Originality : Yet another reflex game 2/5
-Technical quality (size/games, technical challenge ...) : This game is small, but it's not really technically challenging. 3/5
-Total : 28/40
EDIT:someone sticky this so I don't have to find it from the bottom of the screen?
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@Yeong your grading style seems a bit like mine in some ways. I guess what other people did was add points when they found something interesting in the entry or interesting to a certain degree, explaining the low score from them on every entry. Also for them I think BASIC limitations aren't taken into account, so slower speed gets a lot of penalties.
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@all judge: please do not reveal your notation anymore : and when you're done, please send me a PM on the official website (my username : Le solutionneur).
Then we'll (me and contra-sh) make a sum up of the notes you give and give the final results.
So please don't say the results anymore : it should not be given as contra-sh said on the official website.
But you can say what you think about a game (for example : I like worms 'cause we can play with an ia in our team, another example : I like the tool menu 'cause I don't have to create my own menu anymore with this tool.
You can also say that a game is slow or something like that. (@DJ_0 : le but n'étant pas de rabaisser l'auteur mais de permettre aux juges de mieux juger avec justesse pour la rapidité, merci de ne pas te méprendre si des utilisateurs disent qu'un jeu est lent/un jeu est rapide).
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En passant c'est DJ_O, pas DJ_0 :P (Anciennement mon pseudo était DJ Omnimaga sur les forums TI). Anyway je voulais juste que les gens fasse attention pour ne pas que ça aille l'air que certain juges diminuent le travail des auteurs. Certain commentaires, malgré que des trucs ont du se perdre dans la traduction en anglais par moment, semblait vouloir dire des trucs style "ce jeu ne vaut rien car le jeu est lent". For the Omnimaga contest, we criticised games heavily too for their flaws, more than we gave positive criticism, but we tried to make sure it sounds constructive.
I guess it's best to not give the result anymore, though, because it spoils the surprise.
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+1 : if unveiled : no surprise anymore.
Sorry, for the DJ_0, I will write DJ_O from now.
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When do you exspect the judging to be completed and the results shown?
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When do you exspect the judging to be completed and the results shown?
my question too, when do i need to have the grading done?
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Concerning, CHASSE, I'd like to say that it was one of my first programs ever on a calculator : I made it long time ago (in 10th grade, or seconde générale), and I was less gifted than now (If I am :p ).
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my question too, when do i need to have the grading done?
What have you done parser padawan? 25%? 50%? more?
I want to announce the results in 1 week if possible :D
edit : judges, if you see this msg, please post you current progress.
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I'm 99,99 %
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my question too, when do i need to have the grading done?
What have you done parser padawan? 25%? 50%? more?
I have 4 entries left, so yeah. ;D
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Ok, fine :)
I know that matreteyfontias and llylud have already finished. What's about epic7 and yeongJIN_COOL?
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I'm actually done, but where do I send the scores to?
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To the head-judge, I believe. matreteyfontias, if I'm not mistaken.
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To the head-judge, I believe. matreteyfontias, if I'm not mistaken.
To Le solutionneur (or eventually to me).
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ah, ok. when is the due?
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As soon as possible :)
(we want to announce the results this week)
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Hello,
Sorry, I noticed yesterday that I had send the bad File at finaly file, but it is the true file in the global archive. Could you please check that you use the version from the globa archive or the archive called "CALCLIST version finale_3.zip" of my project (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/files/file/CALCLIST%20version%20finale_3.zip).
Thanks
Sandro
PS:sorry for my bad english
En français:
désolé, je viens de me rendre compte que j'ai mis le mauvais fichier en archive finale, mais celui dans l'archive générale du concours est le bon, de même que celle sur la page du projet qui n'est PAS en rouge (donc "CALCLIST version finale_3.zip" ).
Aurriez vous donc l'aimabilité de bien vouloir vérifier que vous utilisez bien la bonne version?
Merci beaucoup
Sandro
PS : si ça intéress quelcun, la vertion que j'ai mise par étourderie en archive finalle est une version non optimisée (et peut-être partiellement buguée), mais elle peut peut-être aider ceux qui voudraient étudier le fonctionnement du programme en détail, vu qu'elle affiche quelques variables essentielles.
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Ok.
Give you results today to Le Solutionneur...
Even if you haven't finished to judge.
Thank you all :)
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LAST DAY TO GIVE YOUR RESULTS !
For that, please PM-me (le solutionneur) on http://tiforge.info/zcontest3
Otherwise, your notation won't count !
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When will results be announced?
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Hybrid results are announced : http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18 (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18)
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wow MuseInc got fairly high score (31/40, which is highest grade for eTI-BASIC utility :P)
Gratz for Heyleia and DT XD
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Congrats Deep and Hayleia! You guys did an awesome job.
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I got a score of around what I expected for a game like robogun.
Grappler will be a lot better :D
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Yay! :w00t:(http://img.removedfromgame.com/imgs/woot.gif) This is the first time I've won a contest. Thank you!
Congrats to Hayleia (is that how you spell it?) and everyone else, too. All of the projects were awesome, and I've played many of them already :D
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Great work to everyone ^^ Congrats Deep Thought! :D
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O.O
:w00t:
This is the first time I participate to a contest and I win a prize (the 2nd one at least) !!!
Congratz to all the other participants, especially Deep Thought :D
(Yes Deep Thought, this is the way to spell it)
(I am writing it from a laptop and I don't like it, so sorry if I did mistakes)
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Congrats to all the winners!
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The basic judges results are out too. See the comment in the latest newsarticle on tiforge.info/zcontest
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There's basic, hybrid and asm results on the website :
http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/ (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/)
Thank you all for your help (all judges especially Le sulutionneur and mdr1)
Thank you to all the participants.
This contest was totally crazy, lot of entries, a very good level. :D
Thank you very much :)
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Wow congrats everyone! Glad to see so many participants and great entries. I wish i had time to try them all.
I can't find ASM results tho ???
EDIT: Nvm they are on TI-Planet news
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Congrats to mdr1 and ztrumpet!
There's basic, hybrid and asm results on the website :
http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/ (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/)
ASM results aren't up yet, are they? I only see Hybrid and BASIC.
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They are shown as a comment of the hybrid section's results ;)
(not sure about the grammar of that sentence)
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Ah I see now. But yeah they're all on TI-Planet news anyway.
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Would it be possible to see the point by point breakdown for all the entries? I would like to know why there's such a spread between Worms and Midnight, and also why Absolute Madness ranked so low, among other things.
Congrats to mdr1!
Edit: Also, when will the grand champion be announced?
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Congrats to all the winners!!!
and yeah, point by point breakdowns would be nice. :)
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and yeah, point by point breakdowns would be nice. :)
I don't think an explanation for every point would be necessary, but if possible, a brief breakdown (like mdr1 posted here (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18#2503), for the ASM category) would be nice (I'd like to see what I should improve) :)
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and yeah, point by point breakdowns would be nice. :)
I don't think an explanation for every point would be necessary, but if possible, a brief breakdown (like mdr1 posted here (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18#2503), for the ASM category) would be nice (I'd like to see what I should improve) :)
yeah, not everything, just a brief overview. :)
and yeah, idk why you got rated down so much on madness, I liked it a lot XD
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This is my first programming contest that I have entered, too! :3 This is so cool! If anybody in this house had a video recorder, my reaction would have gone viral :)
Xeda112358 is a happy bat <^('.')^>
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Xeda112358 is a happy bat <^(^.^)^>
Fixed. :P
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The ASM results have finally been posted on the zContest site. Seems like something went wrong the first time it was posted, but (again) congrats Xeda and KermMartian!
And Xeda, ztrumpet, and Hayleia, see this post (http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=22) for some relevant instructions :)
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hmmm, I can't find a place with point by point breakdowns of extended basic. :(
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Nice to hear, I wondered where they went. Maybe there should be a news about the results at one point, if they can easily be put together.
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Maybe there should be a news about the results at one point, if they can easily be put together.
Definetely. :D
It's hard to understand all the pointer by pointer breakdowns there, cause they're all in french. :-/
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Well I doubt I would translate all judging comments/scoring, else it would be too long O.O
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Thanks much, Deep Thought!
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I've posted my comments on hybrid and a part of the comment from noelthebest.
All project were completely incredible, all the comments are not critics but only feedback to improve your project.
I've posted it in a comment of the hybrid results news : http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18
If you have some question I would love to answer it.
Sorry for the mistake with asm results, I've firstly published it but it seems I've remove it by error after... I'm a little bit stupid sometimes :P
edit : good news my comments are in english :p
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I've posted my comments on hybrid and a part of the comment from noelthebest.
All project were completely incredible, all the comments are not critics but only feedback to improve your project.
I've posted it in a comment of the hybrid results news : http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=18
If you have some question I would love to answer it.
Sorry for the mistake with asm results, I've firstly published it but it seems I've remove it by error after... I'm a little bit stupid sometimes :P
edit : good news my comments are in english :p
:D thanks!
lol It looks like swords was too hard XD
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Yes really hard, even after you have done the little modification to allow jumping even if we are on the border of a platform...
But this is a good game, I 've spended a lot of time trying to finish levels etc...
You've done a great job :)
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Some news about prizes :
The sponsor called me yesterday, and I give him your adress today by mail.
He will send your prizes directly to you (for the USA residents) .
He send the 2 other prizes to me and I will reroute it (prizes for mdr1 and hayleia).
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Cool to hear :D, I really need to try those entries one day. I just was so exhausted from work and other stuff lately. D:
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Awesome! This is going to be really cool :] I've never won a prize like this before o.o
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Un-stickied this topic since the judging is long over.
And as an update it seems they're starting to send the prizes out, yay :w00t: http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=23
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yay :D I can soon play with a new calc :D I hope it gets here before I leave campus for the summer o.o
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Un-stickied this topic since the judging is long over.
And as an update it seems they're starting to send the prizes out, yay :w00t: http://tiforge.info/zcontest3/?a=postcom&t=billet&id=23
The prizes for the previous contest or this one? ALso I hope so, Xeda. It would kinda suck if you received mail there and it got lost. X.x
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It wouldn't get lost, I'd just have to wait until school is back in session XD And it is to zContest2011 (the one from this past winter).
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Ah ok, I meant if for example they just put it at some random place until session starts and then forget or something.
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oh, that would suck D: Typically, they forward male, but I don't know if they would do that for packages x.x
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Typically, they forward male
O.O
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*mail
:P
Not even going to correct my post, I've had a long day XD
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Lol it's fine. But yeah I was just hoping if the college remains empty during Summer with only one or two employee that they won't forget and stuff. X.x