Author Topic: Anti-Virus (Read 22754 times)

Lionel Debroux · « **Reply #15 on:** November 28, 2010, 04:54:15 am »

Well, actually, Microsoft's anti-virus is, on average, even worse than all others (paid for or no-fee). This is because they can't provide a competitive AV, especially for no fee, without the cartel of established AV vendors (who flourish on the persistent insecurity of the Windows platform, on the users' fear of viruses, and on the perception that paid AV must be better than no-fee AV) promptly unleashing an antitrust suit (which Microsoft would almost certainly lose) on Microsoft's back.

Once or twice per year, I fix virus-ridden computers for relatives or neighbors. Those computers do have an anti-virus. Each time I find a virus (usually by manual inspection into system or user folders, startup entries, etc.), I pass the file through the VirusTotal service, which sends the file through about 42 AV engines + databases nowadays. The results are always appalling: I never got a single detection rate above one third (12/36, at the time), and it got as low as 1/42 (and even then, the hit was only a heuristic-based detection, i.e. "this program might do bad things but I'm not sure").

Based on that experience, the only thing I can do is urging people not to buy paid AVs (but for you, it's too late...). The no-fee AVs (except Microsoft's, for the reason I wrote above) are, on average, roughly as ~~good~~ bad as the paid AVs are - but at least, the usage of no-fee AVs deprives the members of the paid AV cartel from a small chunk of the big money they're getting from selling their very inefficient products.
There's no such thing as a "good" AV, and people who voted that they buy "good and expensive" AVs should change their thinking and habits, for everyone's good.

I'm not sure that this is warranted, but some people posit that the Windows platform remains persistently insecure (even so with the safer coding techniques supposed to be used for Vista and 7 - some embarrassing high-profile old bugs remained) because there's more money made that way.

Quigibo · « **Reply #16 on:** November 28, 2010, 05:30:15 am »

If you just use the Internet more safely, you shouldn't need an Anti-Virus software. I haven't gotten a virus or malware for years. And the last time I ever got something I removed it manually, which I believe is the only safe way to do it. The anti-virus industry is really a scam in my opinion. They're generally worse that the viruses themselves because a lot of them are bundled with malware, they are incredibly difficult to uninstall completely, they can reduce the performance of the computer, its just not the type of thing I would ever want. Using the system tools and quick google search is enough to figure out how to remove anything.

Lionel Debroux · « **Reply #17 on:** November 28, 2010, 06:05:15 am »

Yeah, "scam" is quite an appropriate word for the paid AV industry.

Quote

which I believe is the only safe way to do it

and

Quote

Using the system tools and quick google search is enough to figure out how to remove anything.

Nowadays, in the time of best-of-the-breed 2009-2010 virus with rootkit capability and highly random names, this does not always hold true

I saw an active rootkit, detected by F-Secure Blacklight (fsbl.exe), that was defending its main file. Therefore, I booted the latest version of the SystemRescueCD Linux Live CD, I shredded the file before deleting it, and I told the computer's owners "Go make it reinstall by a repair shop, because a rootkited system cannot be trusted anymore, whatever the OS type and version, because it has tampered deep into the OS".

Munchor · « **Reply #18 on:** November 28, 2010, 08:55:04 am »

Quote from: Quigibo on November 28, 2010, 05:30:15 am

If you just use the Internet more safely, you shouldn't need an Anti-Virus software. I haven't gotten a virus or malware for years. And the last time I ever got something I removed it manually, which I believe is the only safe way to do it. The anti-virus industry is really a scam in my opinion. They're generally worse that the viruses themselves because a lot of them are bundled with malware, they are incredibly difficult to uninstall completely, they can reduce the performance of the computer, its just not the type of thing I would ever want. Using the system tools and quick google search is enough to figure out how to remove anything.

I have to disagree, though. From free, legal and simple downloads to large, illegal, suspicious downloads, there are virus. I agree that a free, legal anti-virus is enough. In fact, it's the best thing for 90% of internet users. However, a lot of people use my computer, this is, connect USB drives here, also, I make a few illegal downloads too. So, I feel safer with a 55€ anti-virus than nothing.

There is another thing to add, however, for my family, 55€ is not THAT much for an anti-virus, that's why most people use free ones, which I think is fair

Lionel Debroux · « **Reply #19 on:** November 28, 2010, 09:14:25 am »

Well, you may feel safer with a 55€ AV than with a 0€ AV, but it's, on average, not necessarily true

Munchor · « **Reply #20 on:** November 28, 2010, 09:18:09 am »

Quote from: Lionel Debroux on November 28, 2010, 09:14:25 am

Well, you may feel safer with a 55€ AV than with a 0€ AV, but it's, on average, not necessarily true

I feel safer because when I bought it and my first scan, it scanned a trojan and a malware that the other one hadn't

coolsnake · « **Reply #21 on:** November 28, 2010, 09:38:07 am »

I've always been a big fan of ESET because it's extremely light on system resources. Especially in comparison to Norton.

I changed to Microsoft Security Essentials a couple of months ago. It's hard to say how good the virusprotection actually is but I didn't run into any serious problems thusfar. It's free, has realtime protection and doesn't continually bother me with nagscreens. That's more than enough for me.

Munchor · « **Reply #22 on:** November 28, 2010, 09:44:20 am »

Quote from: coolsnake on November 28, 2010, 09:38:07 am

I've always been a big fan of ESET because it's extremely light on system resources. Especially in comparison to Norton.

I changed to Microsoft Security Essentials a couple of months ago. It's hard to say how good the virusprotection actually is but I didn't run into any serious problems thusfar. It's free, has realtime protection and doesn't continually bother me with nagscreens. That's more than enough for me.

Great for you.

Another side to debate is Linux which is ALMOST virus-free because there are almost no virus for Linux's OSs

AngelFish · « **Reply #23 on:** November 28, 2010, 10:25:28 am »

Quote from: Quigibo on November 28, 2010, 05:30:15 am

If you just use the Internet more safely, you shouldn't need an Anti-Virus software.

While that is generally a good practice, it doesn't always work. For example, I was on Wolfram Alpha a while back on a school computer. It was the first site I had ever visited on that account and yet, five minutes later (I hadn't switched sites), a virus pops up and shuts down the system. The IT guys agreed that it almost certainly came from that site and it was the first virus ever recorded on the school computers (which do have AV). Wonderful

Munchor · « **Reply #24 on:** November 28, 2010, 10:28:40 am »

Quote from: Qwerty.55 on November 28, 2010, 10:25:28 am

Quote from: Quigibo on November 28, 2010, 05:30:15 am
If you just use the Internet more safely, you shouldn't need an Anti-Virus software.

While that is generally a good practice, it doesn't always work. For example, I was on Wolfram Alpha a while back on a school computer. It was the first site I had ever visited on that account and yet, five minutes later (I hadn't switched sites), a virus pops up and shuts down the system. The IT guys agreed that it almost certainly came from that site and it was the first virus ever recorded on the school computers (which do have AV). Wonderful

LOL

In my school, there are AVG in all computers, but half of the settings are turned off and the protection is 'low'...

DJ Omnimaga · « **Reply #25 on:** November 28, 2010, 10:45:26 am »

My favorite anti-virus right now is Avast. I have the free version and it detects most stuff.

I disagree that if you be careful on the Internet you won't get any virus, because if the server where your avatar is hosted gets hacked and files get infected, then you can get infected just by browsing legit websites such as Omnimaga, GameFAQs, etc. This is an example: http://ourl.ca/4281

MOST of the time, though, you won't need an anti-virus if you be careful. I also advise against paying for one. Why pay for an anti-virus software when there are plenty available for free that get the job done just as well?

The best way to avoid getting viruses is to not download any warez, never visit ROM sites, never click Google/Yahoo ads, never follow links in Youtube videos and if you ever get on a torrent site, uncheck any non MP3/OGG/WMV file listed. NEVER download a rar/zip torrent, even if there's a file list posted.

Munchor · « **Reply #26 on:** November 28, 2010, 10:47:04 am »

Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on November 28, 2010, 10:45:26 am

My favorite anti-virus right now is Avast. I have the free version and it detects most stuff.

I disagree that if you be careful on the Internet you won't get any virus, because if the server where your avatar is hosted gets hacked and files get infected, then you can get infected just by browsing legit websites such as Omnimaga, GameFAQs, etc. This is an example: http://ourl.ca/4281

MOST of the time, though, you won't need an anti-virus if you be careful. I also advise against paying for one. Why pay for an anti-virus software when there are plenty available for free that get the job done just as well?

The best way to avoid getting viruses is to not download any warez, never visit ROM sites, never click Google/Yahoo ads, never follow links in Youtube videos and if you ever get on a torrent site, uncheck any non MP3/OGG/WMV file listed. NEVER download a rar/zip torrent, even if there's a file list posted.

Those are good tips, indeed.

kyllopardiun · « **Reply #27 on:** November 28, 2010, 12:38:16 pm »

Live essentials sucks, (I used it)
And I do prefer eset smart security as it doesn't use a large memory space as norton and has a firewall and other features...
And it won many times for the best heuristic AV, however it doesn't have the best database
So if you want to go for it don't forget to set for the heuristics scan.

/*For the price
~44 Euros - 1 year license
~65 Euros - 2 years license

But, as I can't pay it, I do download it when the period expires, so I unistall with revo/ccleaner and then install it again, so I can use it for free.

*/
Note2: It have a portuguese engine, just in case you are considering this as a plus.

Munchor · « **Reply #28 on:** November 28, 2010, 12:40:49 pm »

Quote from: kyllopardiun on November 28, 2010, 12:38:16 pm

Live essentials sucks, (I used it)
And I do prefer eset smart security as it doesn't use a large memory space as norton and has a firewall and other features...
And it won many times for the best heuristic AV, however it doesn't have the best database
So if you want to go for it don't forget to set for the heuristics scan.

/*For the price
~44 Euros - 1 year license
~65 Euros - 2 years license

But, as I can't pay it, I do download it when the period expires, so I unistall with revo/ccleaner and then install it again, so I can use it for free.

*/
Note2: It have a portuguese engine, just in case you are considering this as a plus.

/*Nos aqui ate podemos falar portugues, eu nao estou interessado no Microsoft Security Essentials, uso o Kaspersky 2011 e gosto muito. Mas e bom saber que alguem nao gosta dele. Ja agora, porque tem respeito negativo.O?
*/

Some portuguese conversation around here...

kyllopardiun · « **Reply #29 on:** November 28, 2010, 12:52:36 pm »

/*
Quando a procurar por arquivos, muitas vezes ele não encontra nada mesmo que seja um vírus.
Se estiver usando o mesmo, pode até achar que funciona, mas, quando passar outro programa pode ser que haja diversos softwares maliciosos no mesmo.
*/

-Just my review about, how does microsoft antivirus sucks, in portuguese.
//sorry for not finding a better word for it, as it may look too much vulgar but, it's how I see this software.

Author Topic: Anti-Virus (Read 22754 times)

Lionel Debroux

Re: Anti-Virus

Quigibo

Re: Anti-Virus

Lionel Debroux

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

Lionel Debroux

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

coolsnake

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

AngelFish

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

DJ Omnimaga

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

kyllopardiun

Re: Anti-Virus

Munchor

Re: Anti-Virus

kyllopardiun

Re: Anti-Virus