Author Topic: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?  (Read 2453 times)

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Offline Chirlian

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C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« on: February 19, 2017, 01:14:19 pm »
Hi,
I am a unexperienced Nspire user and like to learn it to program (tools and maybe games). After some tries with TI basic and lua, I saw in forums that several programmers recommend to use c++. So I started my 1st try, knowing that i had an introduction course in c programming at 1988 or so... The installation under ms-dos was simple at this days.
Ok, that was my try:
used this tutorial:
https://hackspire.org/index.php/C_and_assembly_development_introduction
-loaded os 4.4.0 and ndless 4.4 and installed both, everything looks ok
-loaded ndless-sdk from github (ndless-master)
-there is the info in the tut to install Cygwin and several other 'dependencies' (18). At other places it's told to install only 2, MinMW and MSYS, but here it's told that they don't work correctly.
So, is this really the way? Now I see why there are not so very much programmers that use c++ for nspire. Such a lot of programs/tools to get a c++ compiler to install?! Really discouraging. It must be a lot of work to get this all together, handle them right and get the whole thing started to compile the 1st hello world. My respect to all them who did it! But isn't there another way?
klaus

Offline shmibs

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2017, 04:11:22 pm »
windows is very bad at supporting developers, and c and c++ development especially so. other systems have all these toolchain prerequisites installed by default (or, if not, easily available via package manager and official packages, which take five minutes or so to install). windows was not designed to support c and c++ development, however, and all microsoft's attempts at adding it have been an afterthought that's perpetually non-standards-compliant.

so no, there isn't any other way unless you're willing to switch operating systems, basically.

Offline Ranman

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2017, 08:33:11 pm »
Are you really wanting to do C++? How about trusty old C?

I've never tried using C on the TI-84CE so I cannot speak to it. Although this capability really has me interested in purchasing a TI84CE. ;)

However, C on the TI-89, 89TI, 92+, and V200 is amazingly easy. Simply install GCC4TI or TIGCC on your PC and that's it... you're good to go.
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Offline Legimet

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2017, 11:21:16 pm »
I think if you're using Windows 10, there is an "Ubuntu subsystem" that you can use.

Offline Chirlian

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2017, 09:27:10 am »
Installing C++ on Windows seems simple, compared to the Nspire Version. Handling it is not so simple...
But using another OS for using C++ is not what I would tellm user friendly, it means a 2 stage way and handling linux is not a thing that I get used in short time. But thanks for your answer.

windows is very bad at supporting developers, and c and c++ development especially so. other systems have all these toolchain prerequisites installed by default (or, if not, easily available via package manager and official packages, which take five minutes or so to install). windows was not designed to support c and c++ development, however, and all microsoft's attempts at adding it have been an afterthought that's perpetually non-standards-compliant.

so no, there isn't any other way unless you're willing to switch operating systems, basically.



A important aspect for a language is the acceptance of it. Nicest language is not attractive to me when I don't find much support and few ppl who uses it. So I think C++ has some usage for Nspire but C I don't see so often. And programming on the old calculators with bw and non lighted lcd I don't like. Thanks for your hints.

Are you really wanting to do C++? How about trusty old C?

I've never tried using C on the TI-84CE so I cannot speak to it. Although this capability really has me interested in purchasing a TI84CE. ;)

However, C on the TI-89, 89TI, 92+, and V200 is amazingly easy. Simply install GCC4TI or TIGCC on your PC and that's it... you're good to go.



Hm, I think I would prefer to use a linux but a subsystem. But starting with another OS means a lot to learn about its handling just before I can write my Hello World in C++. Means a 2 stage acting. Together with the high need of time to learn C++ it's to much, I think. Its really strange, older calculators can get programmed much better then the nspire but have the awful dark bw displays, the nspire has a wonderful hardware, but got effectively locked by TI to hinder its prgramming. What fools makes such decisions in chief etage?

I think if you're using Windows 10, there is an "Ubuntu subsystem" that you can use.

Edit (Eeems): Merged triple post
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 12:56:42 pm by Eeems »

Offline shmibs

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2017, 02:23:07 pm »
Installing C++ on Windows seems simple, compared to the Nspire Version. Handling it is not so simple...
But using another OS for using C++ is not what I would tellm user friendly, it means a 2 stage way and handling linux is not a thing that I get used in short time. But thanks for your answer.

as i said, either going through the steps of setting up mingw et. al or just using literally any desktop / server operating system other than windows is necessary for getting this to work. windows has "C and C++ support", but it's an afterthought that has never conformed to the standard everybody else does.

or i guess you can try to struggle with whatever frankenstein of gpl-stripped code and ancient bash it is they're calling an "ubuntu subsystem" on windows 10, but don't expect that to go anywhere either.

A important aspect for a language is the acceptance of it. Nicest language is not attractive to me when I don't find much support and few ppl who uses it. So I think C++ has some usage for Nspire but C I don't see so often. And programming on the old calculators with bw and non lighted lcd I don't like. Thanks for your hints.

C is a much more sensible choice for this kind of thing, honestly. the potential benefits of C++ over C can be summed up as higher-level abstractions and auto-pointers for handling memory, which can lead to non-trivial overhead on a system this tight on resources. take those away, and you're left with what's essentially an out-dated C fork.

as for language acceptance, C is still very much a relevant language (see http://githut.info/). whether it's used the most for this particular platform shouldn't be relevent except in terms of library support.

Offline Chirlian

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2017, 06:48:35 pm »
Installing C++ on Windows seems simple, compared to the Nspire Version. Handling it is not so simple...
But using another OS for using C++ is not what I would tellm user friendly, it means a 2 stage way and handling linux is not a thing that I get used in short time. But thanks for your answer.

as i said, either going through the steps of setting up mingw et. al or just using literally any desktop / server operating system other than windows is necessary for getting this to work. windows has "C and C++ support", but it's an afterthought that has never conformed to the standard everybody else does.

or i guess you can try to struggle with whatever frankenstein of gpl-stripped code and ancient bash it is they're calling an "ubuntu subsystem" on windows 10, but don't expect that to go anywhere either.

Yes, I would never expect a stabil working system by such construction..
A important aspect for a language is the acceptance of it. Nicest language is not attractive to me when I don't find much support and few ppl who uses it. So I think C++ has some usage for Nspire but C I don't see so often. And programming on the old calculators with bw and non lighted lcd I don't like. Thanks for your hints.

C is a much more sensible choice for this kind of thing, honestly. the potential benefits of C++ over C can be summed up as higher-level abstractions and auto-pointers for handling memory, which can lead to non-trivial overhead on a system this tight on resources. take those away, and you're left with what's essentially an out-dated C fork.


Phew, thats beyond my really simple english. Means that you recommend the older c? Infos about installing c I found only at hackspire (c++).


as for language acceptance, C is still very much a relevant language (see http://githut.info/). whether it's used the most for this particular platform shouldn't be relevent except in terms of library support.

Which way would you recommend: installing at windows (7, 64) or using one of the linux versions and install it there? What may be more stabil and better to handle? It looks as if you're favorising linux. I saw at hackspire that there are about the half lot of dependencies need to be installed than the windows version.

Edit (Eeems): Format fix
« Last Edit: February 22, 2017, 04:33:11 pm by Eeems »

Offline shmibs

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Re: C++ on Nspire-way through eye of a needle?
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2017, 10:09:02 pm »
oh, i'm sorry. i'll try to simplify my english X_X

if you have windows 7, i would recommend using a virtual machine. a good option is virtualbox. install the virtual machine on your windows system and install a linux operating system on the virtual machine. then, using the virtual machine, follow the instructions given for a linux system.

overall, this is the easiest route. installing mingw is very tedious and difficult. installing a linux distribution in a virtual machine takes only a few mouse clicks.