« previous next »
Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)  (Read 4663 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« on: June 01, 2013, 11:36:28 pm »
Some of you probably remember those rumors about the Flash ROM eventually wearing out on Z80 calculator models if it's rewritten like 200000 times or sooner if it's defective (like one of the 2009 contest guy). However, when you use StorePic on a TI-84 Plus C Silver Edition, it stores a 22 KB large picture file directly into archive.

What I was wondering is if a BASIC game that continuously uses the StorePic command during extended periods of time could eventually cause such problems with the calculator Flash chip, or if it was written differently so that it won't cause those issues (assuming they're not just an urban legend)?

Also, does using StorePic on a 84+CSE eventually causes Garbage Collecting? If so, then I guess heavy use is out of the question in games, since some people would end up having to garbage collect every 3 minute or so.
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline tr1p1ea

  • LV7 Elite (Next: 700)
  • *******
  • Posts: 647
  • Rating: +110/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2013, 01:52:38 am »
I guess since it does write to archive then naturally if you were to use it over and over it would wear out FlashROM.

Perhaps an ASM lib can be made that will allow you to 'storePIC' to the extra RAM pages instead?
Logged
"My world is Black & White. But if I blink fast enough, I see it in Grayscale."

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2013, 11:45:02 am »
Yeah I'm curious in case TI might have addressed the issue (assuming there was an issue at all to begin with, but I'm sure there was, since the 84+CSE uses the same hardware (other than the LCD) as the older 84+SE, which were heavily based on the 1999 83+ calcs.

An ASM lib to StorePic to extra RAM would definitively be nice, even if just a few pics. In my case, I was wondering, because in Zelda I would like to speed up map display by storing the generic map stuff into a pic for future display, but I would have to recall the pic everytime Link moves to a new room.
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline Jim Bauwens

  • Lua! Nspire! Linux!
  • Editor
  • LV10 31337 u53r (Next: 2000)
  • **********
  • Posts: 1881
  • Rating: +206/-7
  • Linux!
    • View Profile
    • nothing...
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2013, 12:32:29 pm »
Quote from: DJ Omnimaga on June 02, 2013, 11:45:02 am
An ASM lib to StorePic to extra RAM would definitively be nice, even if just a few pics. In my case, I was wondering, because in Zelda I would like to speed up map display by storing the generic map stuff into a pic for future display, but I would have to recall the pic everytime Link moves to a new room.

Recalling the pic shouldn't wear out the Flash ROM as far as I know. It's the writing that would be the problem. So if you don't have to constantly store the screen there shouldn't be a problem.
Logged

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2013, 01:09:31 pm »
Ah right that's true. There still is the issue about storing often, though (when switching to another dungeon)
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline Sorunome

  • Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox!
  • Support Staff
  • LV13 Extreme Addict (Next: 9001)
  • *************
  • Posts: 7920
  • Rating: +374/-13
  • Derpy Hooves
    • View Profile
    • My website! (You might lose the game)
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2013, 03:02:09 pm »
You could try to make a tilemapper somehow (even though it takes longer to draw the screen), the flash wouldn't wear out.
Logged

THE GAME
Also, check out my website
If OmnomIRC is screwed up, blame me!
Click here to give me an internet!

Offline ben_g

  • Hey cool I can set a custom title now :)
  • LV9 Veteran (Next: 1337)
  • *********
  • Posts: 1002
  • Rating: +125/-4
  • Asm noob
    • View Profile
    • Our programmer's team: GameCommandoSquad
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2013, 04:32:43 pm »
I guess you can test it by filling the memory of your CSE untill it can only store a few images, then call storePic a few times. If it starts garbage collecting, you know it can't be used in games.(That is, assuming that pics are handled as normal files, and that the calc doesn't reset the pages the pic is on every time you call storePic)
Logged
My projects
 - The Lost Survivors (Unreal Engine) ACTIVE [GameCommandoSquad main project]
 - Oxo, with single-calc multiplayer and AI (axe) RELEASED (screenshot) (topic)
 - An android version of oxo (java)  ACTIVE
 - A 3D collision detection library (axe) RELEASED! (topic)(screenshot)(more recent screenshot)(screenshot of it being used in a tilemapper)
Spoiler For inactive:
- A first person shooter with a polygon-based 3d engine. (z80, will probably be recoded in axe using GLib) ON HOLD (screenshot)
 - A java MORPG. (pc) DEEP COMA(read more)(screenshot)
 - a minecraft game in axe DEAD (source code available)
 - a 3D racing game (axe) ON HOLD (outdated screenshot of asm version)

This signature was last updated on 20/04/2015 and may be outdated

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2013, 06:50:13 pm »
Quote from: Sorunome on June 02, 2013, 03:02:09 pm
You could try to make a tilemapper somehow (even though it takes longer to draw the screen), the flash wouldn't wear out.
Due to the way the maps are drawn, I bet a tilemapper would take at least 10 more seconds.

Quote from: ben_g on June 02, 2013, 04:32:43 pm
I guess you can test it by filling the memory of your CSE untill it can only store a few images, then call storePic a few times. If it starts garbage collecting, you know it can't be used in games.(That is, assuming that pics are handled as normal files, and that the calc doesn't reset the pages the pic is on every time you call storePic)
Yeah I will probably have to try that.
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2013, 01:21:45 am »
UPDATE!

StorePic causes GarbageCollecting eventually. I ran a loop counting down by 21956 every loop, starting around 3500000. Eventually, it got slightly slower, but not very noticeable, then it Garbage Collected. However, it didn't ask me if I wanted to do it: It simply started GC'ing automatically, like when you try to send an APP to the calc.

So yeah it does the same thing as when you archive a standard variable. Basically, I would be fine using it in Zelda, as long as it's not too often (basically, only StorePic when switching dungeons). I still have to keep in mind the people who will have most of their archive filled.
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline Sorunome

  • Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox Fox!
  • Support Staff
  • LV13 Extreme Addict (Next: 9001)
  • *************
  • Posts: 7920
  • Rating: +374/-13
  • Derpy Hooves
    • View Profile
    • My website! (You might lose the game)
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2013, 03:11:39 pm »
That is interesting.
But it would kinda suck if you play and suddenly garbage collect >.<

and 3000th post!!!!!! Let's party! :D
Logged

THE GAME
Also, check out my website
If OmnomIRC is screwed up, blame me!
Click here to give me an internet!

Offline Dapianokid

  • LV7 Elite (Next: 700)
  • *******
  • Posts: 539
  • Rating: +46/-27
  • That one dude
    • View Profile
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2013, 03:14:58 pm »
WOOOOOOOT SORUNOME!
Logged
Keep trying.

Offline DJ Omnimaga

  • Clacualters are teh gr33t
  • CoT Emeritus
  • LV15 Omnimagician (Next: --)
  • *
  • Posts: 55942
  • Rating: +3154/-232
  • CodeWalrus founder & retired Omnimaga founder
    • View Profile
    • Dream of Omnimaga Music
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #11 on: June 05, 2013, 03:38:07 pm »
Quote from: Sorunome on June 05, 2013, 03:11:39 pm
That is interesting.
But it would kinda suck if you play and suddenly garbage collect >.<

and 3000th post!!!!!! Let's party! :D
Well, not if it automatically starts GCing, since you can't accidentally select "1:No". In ROL1 and 2 we could select No so if someone kept mashing the 1 or ENTER button before a battle, he had big chances to stop game execution by mistake, losing his progress.
Logged
Now active at https://discord.gg/cuZcfcF (CodeWalrus server)

Offline Streetwalrus

  • LV12 Extreme Poster (Next: 5000)
  • ************
  • Posts: 3821
  • Rating: +80/-8
    • View Profile
Re: Can StorePic damage Flash ROM? (84+CSE)
« Reply #12 on: June 05, 2013, 03:39:50 pm »
Yay ! Everybody dance !
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
« previous next »